If you do not meet your rental prospects to show them your house and you use a Lock Box on the door,....what are you min. requirements for a total stranger get access to your house?

Never use a lock box anymore, going on 25 years now. Once a person get's inside, had a key and a phony stationary that says they paid the rent -- the police will do nothing because it's now a civil matter -- your word against theirs.

Roy,

For YEARS (20?) we just left the front door unlocked. Worked great for years without a hitch. Town of 45,000 people, Midwest values.

Then we went to code 0000 and promoted it on our website and fliers. That worked great for years. Probably rented 1000 leases over time with these 2 systems. Casualties: 1 window AC my guys SHOULD have removed, 1 $150 used stove the day before Thanksgiving, and a few unflushed toilets. (C'mon! Ya can't push the flush handle??)

Now, with increased opioid addicts looking for places to shoot up and more homeless people we have to lock them. Rats. It used to be sooo easy!

We don't bother with phone or email prescreening steps. App is free online or at the house, fill it out, once the app is mostly OK we text them "Congrats you are pre-approved for up to $XXX in rent. Which home are you interested in touring? See photos and video walkthru on www.BRAD20,000....." If they respond we text them the code for that home, ask them to text us when they enter and again when they lock up, along with their remarks or decision.

If we don't see a lock up text within 30 minutes after the ENTERED text we text them again. They usually say they forgot to reply.

Please notice

-the simplicity and small number of few steps.

-We did NOT spend ANY time on the 99 who do not qualify.

-We're only texting 2-3 per home

-We have not yet met them because it does not matter. They lie in person. Liars WANT to meet the LL so they can convince the LL with their lies. We have their paper qualification and will not sign a lease until they pass the 2 Minute In Home Visit. Can pay, can care for the home. Good.

-Most apps are disqualified in seconds with a simple check of online court records and/or their paystubs (or lack of!)

Roy, Try it on one house. You'll love it!

BRAD

Thanks Brad20k,

I am trying to get the nerve up to try this. To me, it like leaving your new car parked with the keys in the ignition.

I'm not a fan of this, however I've had to do some lately out of necessity.

NE,

That is what I asking here. How do you pre-screen a total stranger that wants to see your house (NOW) instead of when it is convenient for you to open the door for them?

Roy - I was very skeptical of this process at first as well. I met Sid and Brad20,000 (and you for that matter) at St. Louis this year and really listened to their process on how to do lockbox showings. I had a vacant house already, so when I got back from convention the fist thing I did was buy a lockbox. I implemented the process for prescreening and gave it a go on just one house. It was UNBELIEVABLE how much time it cut out of my schedule. My next step was to buy 4 more lockboxes!

My first step now when someone moves out is to get the lockbox on the door asap. I use this for contractors, handyman, cleaning people, etc. I no longer meet anyone at the house. After it's ready to go, it goes up on the website and showing requests start coming in. Like BRAD said, most requests are screened out in seconds. Not enough income or pits is the 2 most common reasons for me (they used to get showings in the past and waste my time!). The ones that pass the prescreen, I call and not text to set up the appt. This allows for further screening (no sob stories about the current LL, etc). If they have to move ASAP, huge red flag and they 99% sure to be disqualified. To answer your question to NE, nobody gets to see the place NOW. They must all go to the website and fill out the request for showing so I can pre-screen them.

Overall, this has really streamlined my process. This is the reason I went to St. Louis as I couldn't continue how I was doing it. It was taking way too much time. I'm tweaking the process still, but it is working out very nicely. I do understand why some folks on here don't like it. I don't blame them. They have their reasons and they are valid. For me though, I don't have the time. The last house I rented, I probably spent a total of 2 hours on it. 1 hour of it was because the guy that rented it live in a neighboring town and I had to drive further for the in home inspection. Worth it!

Roy, they fill out my website form that includes:

1) First name, last name, middle initial. Takes me 30 second to run that thru Missouri Case Net for a free background check.

2) Documented household income. Must be 3x the rent, minimum.

3) Reason for moving. Nothing bad about past land lord.

4) Current living arrangements. Living in a motel? Nope.

5) How soon will you be ready to move?

If the answers aren't to my liking, we don't do anything else.

Brad's system is really good, but realize he has a slightly different business model. 99% of his homes are Rent To Own, so those folks are more motivated to give out an entire application because they're stepping up their game to become home "owners".

Renters aren't so willing to take the time to fill out a 4 page application and pay our credit check fee just to get a tour.

My worst "casualties" to date are one unflushed toilet and one light left on. 4 years. That works out to at least 500 trips to and from to show houses saved @ 10 miles round trip plus time, no-shows, looky-loos....do the math on how much time and money I've saved!

When I give out the code, I always remind them that our handyman will be in and out during the week and to say "hi" to him if he's there. He's the one who drives the big dually pick up truck. Now do you think crack-head Bob will come cause trouble in my rental when "Larry" the redneck maintenance man could show up at any time?

Roy, they wouldn't be standing at the door calling me. I don't put out rent signs in the yard.

I ask them the same pre-screen questions as before. If they don't qualify, they don't get the code.

Roy, the lockbox is the easiest, least expensive way to allow entry for prospective tenants. You should try it.

But, if you work a neighborhood that is too dangerous for lockbox, then hire a doorman.....the bigger picture is that showing takes too much of your time.

Get their application, screen...then spend some time with them during the in home inspection.

As for the pre screen: my leads come from FB marketplace and Zillow. Over 100 inquiries are the norm in my market (many are looking for a house 100 miles away from my locale).

I send every one of them the lockbox code. 10 or less show up to look.

Roy, haven't you gone though a dozen of these threads already?

In large part, it comes down to how your local authorities will react if a person takes advantage of access by squatting. As Robert J points out, a fake lease, a fake receipt plus a key will (in his jurisdiction and mine) force you to evict a squatter, costing him (and me) a lot of money.

So I have never used a lock box to show, and I will not. I got rid of my last Los Angeles rental (I used a realtor to show it), and now my furthest unit is about 25 minutes away from my office.

At a guess (I don't keep stats), my last vacancy, we showed to three applicants before it rented -- and two of those were shown by our handiman who was already at the property doing last-minute check-list items. (Somehow, I always find some items to put on a punch-list after the crew announces a property is "ready.")

On the other hand, Brad knows his local authorities very well, and they will help him out if a squatter tries to take possession. For him, the risk of a squatter is much less, so he can do these lock-box showings.

It seems many of the lock box only crowd here has a website where the applicants go first and fill-out online applications. I do not have that,..yet.

I post my phone number on my Zillow Ads because I want people to call me so that I can pre-screen on the phone. This works for me, so far,...but I am going make an attempt to use a lock box and see how I can make it work to my advantage. I may even just leave the back door unlocked.

I do have one question for the lock-box LL's here. When there is no water on at your vacancy and someone's takes a dump in your toilet, are you the one who has to deal with this stinking mess?

Roy,

Robin,

"I post my phone number on my Zillow Ads because I want people to call me so that I can pre-screen on the phone."

One thing I picked up from Sid and others here is to stop talking with the tenant until absolutely necessary. I used text to pre-screen the last 3 folks I placed in the rooming house and it worked great. The first thing is it forces me to be consistent. I find that when I'm talking with people, I may forget to ask a question. By texting them a canned questionnaire, I make sure I ask everyone the same questions and before I show the place, I insist that they text me a copy of their latest paystub as well. I also run their criminal background using PA Courts. They nearly approved before I agree to show. This was very effective for me and I was far less harried answering calls.

Gkarl said, "One thing I picked up from Sid and others here is to stop talking with the tenant until absolutely necessary".

I completely disagree with this. Call me ole fashioned or whatever, but if you feel uncomfortable talking with strangers on the phone and want to avoid this at all costs, then maybe you need to hire a PM to handle your customers. Bottom line is this: This is a PEOPLE business we are in here and you have learn how to manage people or they will manage you. My people management starts with that first phone call from my Zillow Ads in which I introduce myself and tell them I am the Property Manager. I can tell a lot about someone from just 'listening to them talk or ramble' on the phone which is not something you can get from an online application.

Like you said Roy, old fashioned. I used to want to listen to the ramblings, now I don't even want to hear their voice.

Even buy anything from amazon? eBay? Any other online shopping venue? Did you talk to anyone? Did anyone there talk to you?

Roy, how's texting a tenant different than discussing real estate matters here? I can tell a lot about a person by how they write and answer questions. I find my people management skills are actually enhanced by handling them in this way. It's just another management tool.

NE,

If you were going to hand over the keys to a $100,000 house to a total stranger, wouldn't you want to have some ole fashioned conversation before you did that? Amazon, Ebay etc. that is nickle and dime crap compared to what I am selling or renting. No, I don't need to talk to anyone when I am buying a power saw or whatever at online retailers. I do understand your point though.

I will add this though,...if I had Class A or B applicants, I would probably use the Lock-Box method and not think twice about it. However, Class C (and some D's mixed in there) are completely different breed of applicant than A's & B's. One reason I talk to people on the phone and meet them in person is to separate the good C's from the D & F applicants. Sometimes C's, D's and F's are all members of the same family! How do you do this with an online application?

I use jotform for an online application. I will eventually talk to them of course. Usually they are weeded out before that.

Now keep in mind, I am in the infancy stages of moving into the lock box showings. I am doing it almost out of necessity, because I had quite a few vacancies the last two months and scheduling a showing in person was overwhelming. So I had to do lockboxes and it has worked out pretty good.

You will obviously interact with them before you sign a lease and handover the keys, but if you can refine how do you pre-screen and weed out the tire kickers ahead of time, then I see no reason to talk to the toothless time wasters.

I've been doing digital prescreening for a while before I have moved in the lockboxes, so there's been very little talking going on for quite some time now. I will just trade the In person showings and getting to view the applicant's personality and appearance with lockbox showings and in home inspections. By the time the in-home inspection happens, I will have an approved application so there's very few interactions that will be happening.

Trust me, I never thought I would be moving in the direction of lockbox showings. But I'm warming up to it and I've received many many other very good ideas from this forum, so I'm going to go this route until I exhaust of the possibilities of it being a benefit to my business before I totally scrap the idea.

Another thing Roy, is that it took quite a while for this to make sense to me. I had to think about it and re-organize it in my mind so it could fit into what I do. Now there are still times where I won't do this, because they are houses in rougher areas. But on most of units, definitely. But I'm still pre-screening electronically.

Two main reasons I did it, to save time and I'm sick of looking at and talking to and dealing with the circus performers that make it through the prescreening sometimes and then want to stand there and talk to me about every little problem in their life and how their current landlord doesn't do this and doesn't do that and blah blah blah. Because at the end of the day, I do not care and I do not want to hear it.

Roy,

Solve your unflushed toilet worry with a $1.25 roll of Saran wrap.

If you don't want to Saran wrap your toilet, so what if you end up having to plunge, flush, then scrub a toilet? A few strokes of the old plunger, a cap full of bleach swished with a toilet brush, and in less than 30 seconds you can flush your problem away!

There's some folks on this board who refuse to see the benefits and low risks of lock box showing in EVERY market. I have explained multiple times how I deal with potential risk of squatters and vandals, so I'm not going to do it again. Folks either find the way to make it work or they don't. Doesn't affect me which way they choose to go. I wish they'd TRY it before dismissing it.

I enjoy being 100% full with a less than 3% vacancy rate for the year and spending hardly any time showing. The method works. It can work for you and anyone else too.

It's not a debatable issue to me. The success rate is TOO HIGH and the worries are TOO FEW to let this tool go unused.

I have yet to actually see any one say, "I tried the lock box and I got a squatter." It's always "what IF I got a squatter?" I don't function on "what if."

Sisco hit the nail on the head: if you want to reach the next level of success you have to think BIG PICTURE. For those who insist that lock box can't work, at least hire someone (doorman) to show units. Don't waste your valuable time doing a $10/hour, unskilled job. It takes minimal skill/effort to drive a car to a house and unlock a door.

Remember your post "Your Hourly Rate?" from last week? How do you think I met and exceeded my $200/hour goal so quickly? I've been eliminating/outsourcing low value tasks like in-person showing and replacing it with high value tasks like the 2-minute in home inspection. But soon that task will be outsourced as well. Now that I've done a few of those, my checklist is taking shape. Soon I will hand it off to someone for $25. Why? I'm looking to add at least 5 more units before 2018 is done. I don't have time to risk letting the best deals thru my fingers because I'm fiddling with showings, etc.

Sid,

Roy, awesome! You've taken the first step into a world I think you will love!

If you and I think at all alike (and I suspect we were twin brothers separated at birth), what you'll do is the first week of lock box, you'll drive past the house every day (maybe twice) and check on your baby to make sure she's okay. That's fine! That's normal! I did that too.

After a week of no incidents, you'll start to relax and go every other day.

So on and so forth, until you get comfy. Then maybe you'll go by once or twice a week, which is what I do today to make sure there aren't any lights left on or windows propped open.

A caveat: are there risks? Yes, there are. Every strategy has risks. It's up to you and me to have a plan to mitigate and reduce risks.

With in-person showing you risk missing out on qualified tenants as you juggle your schedule to fit theirs. You also risk missing awesome real estate deals because you can only be in one place at a time. Either you can be scouting deals and making offers or you can be unlocking doors for people who no-show. There is a risk of looky-loos who have no business being in your rental wasting your valuable time and gasoline.

Leaving the back door open you risk transients setting up camp.

The bottom line: EVERY strategy has risks. Our job as investors is to reduce that risk to an acceptable level.

Every big company in corporate America has a department called "risk management." There is no such thing as risk elimination. I think that's what trips up so many folks with lock box showings. Their fear of the risks is not an accurate picture of reality and they don't expend the effort to find ways to minimize the probability and the extent of risk. They want zero risk. Unfortunately, they don't know how to value their time and ignore the risk of wasting it doing low-value tasks.

All this is meant to encourage you, and to prepare you in case you do end up with someone who takes a dump in the tub. Again, this IS a risk if you Saran wrap your toilet! It COULD happen. But....your job now is to think "how could I minimize the risk of someone doing #2 in my bathtub".

I've been doing lock box for over 4 years. NEVER had someone do this in my tubs.

NE, baby steps, just like Dave Ramsey says!

You'll get comfier eventually. What strategies have you thought of to help make you more comfy?

These two lines help me sleep better:

1) "I've let our handyman know you may stop by today..."

I created a google form for tenants to fill out. If they don't fill out the form, I don't contact them for a showing. I ask email,name, income, pets, credit/criminal issues they want to tell me about. If they pass muster, I contact them via email and tell them that they are welcome to tour the home at their convenience. Please text me when they are at the property and I will give them "that days" code. Ask them to text when they are done so that "my handyman can go change the code." or "he may be there working, and if so, no need to text me when you leave."