Tenant damages to floor (by ROBERT L. LEBLANC, I [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 11:40 AM|
Tenant damages to floor (by LisaFL [FL]) Jul 7, 2018 11:42 AM
Tenant damages to floor (by ROBERT L. LEBLANC, I [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 12:00 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by JB [OR]) Jul 7, 2018 12:18 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by JB [OR]) Jul 7, 2018 12:19 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Ken [NY]) Jul 7, 2018 12:26 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by NE [PA]) Jul 7, 2018 12:44 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Deanna [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 12:50 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 12:56 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 12:58 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 12:59 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 1:00 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Moshe [CA]) Jul 7, 2018 1:03 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Tom [FL]) Jul 7, 2018 1:23 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by JB [OR]) Jul 7, 2018 1:24 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Tom [FL]) Jul 7, 2018 1:36 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 1:36 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 1:43 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by JR [ME]) Jul 7, 2018 2:04 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by AllyM [NJ]) Jul 7, 2018 2:16 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by TOM [FL]) Jul 7, 2018 2:33 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Lynda [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 2:52 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by NC INVESTOR [NC]) Jul 7, 2018 3:54 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Deanna [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 4:51 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 4:56 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Small potatoes [NY]) Jul 7, 2018 5:07 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by AllyM [NJ]) Jul 7, 2018 6:14 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by NC INVESTOR [NC]) Jul 7, 2018 6:48 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert J [CA]) Jul 7, 2018 7:12 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Jul 7, 2018 7:21 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by cjo,'h [CT]) Jul 7, 2018 8:16 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Tom [FL]) Jul 7, 2018 8:26 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by cjo'h [CT]) Jul 7, 2018 8:27 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Vee [OH]) Jul 8, 2018 5:17 AM
Tenant damages to floor (by RathdrumGal [ID]) Jul 8, 2018 7:39 AM
Tenant damages to floor (by Nellie [ME]) Jul 8, 2018 6:29 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Hoosier [IN]) Jul 8, 2018 7:36 PM
Tenant damages to floor (by Sisco [MO]) Jul 9, 2018 6:58 AM
Tenant damages to floor (by ROBERT L. LEBLANC, I [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 11:40 AM
3 years ago I installed matte luxury vinyl plank flooring in most of the downstairs. Upon inspecting the property after move out, I discovered the tenants had applied a polish/wax to the floors.
I had two flooring experts out and they both assessed there was no way to remove the polish/wax and restore to the matte finish. The only option is replacement.
My question is, are the renters responsible for repair, which in this case is replacing? Happy to provide any additional detail. Thanks in advance for your input. --47.188.xx.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by LisaFL [FL]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 11:42 AM
That's a hard one. They obviously were trying to care for the flooring. I'd blame myself for this one if I didn't give them specific cleaning and maintenance instructions that I had them sign off on when they moved in.
Because I've been there before I've learned from my mistakes. --173.170.xxx.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by ROBERT L. LEBLANC, I [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 12:00 PM
Thanks for responding. There are also a fair amount of scratches on the flooring and my guess is they applied the product to hide some of these.
The floors look awful and as I said, cannot be repaired. The cost of replacement is 12k and i do not want to bear that cost.
Even though I did not spell out how to care for the floors, would it not still be their responsibility.
Tenant damages to floor (by JB [OR]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 12:18 PM
I would think they would be mostly responsible for the cost of the floors if they damaged them. Yes.
But $12000 for flooring replacement??? How do you think they will come up with that? Most of my tenants struggle to find $12 for two packs of cigarettes. And Texas is not a garnishable state...
You're in for a fight on this one, even though you're right. --50.45.xxx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by JB [OR]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 12:19 PM
Oh, and you should be using an alias on this site (or pretty much anywhere else on the web for that matter). --50.45.xxx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by Ken [NY]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 12:26 PM
I think they should be responsible for the damage but $12000 worth of damage? how much is the house worth? I buy most of my houses for less than $12000 --72.231.xxx.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 12:44 PM
How does it look? Can you just keep it or fix it with more of what they applied? --174.201.xx.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Deanna [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 12:50 PM
Unless you're dealing with a rental that goes for $3-$5k+ per month, and you're trying to cater to that demographic's Expectations, I think this might have been a lesson in overinprovement. We don't have control over how our tenants care for our stuff, whether it's a misguided attempt at housekeeping or trying to fix damage. You want something durable that will survive numerous turnovers, not luxury finishes that are irreplacably damaged before the first tenant leaves.
I presume the $12k includes the installation costs? And for a downstairs, call it anywhere from 1000 sf-1500 sf? That works out to $8-$12/foot installed. I try to be in the $2/foot installed range... but I know my market can't handle the good stuff, and wouldn't pay me more for it if they could. :) --166.137.xxx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 12:56 PM
The house is a 400k value house. It is one we lived in and decided to rent due to transfer rather than sell.
Rent is 2500 month. --174.206.x.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 12:58 PM
Square footage of house is a little over 3k --174.206.x.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 12:59 PM
Thank you for the advice on real name JB --174.206.x.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 1:00 PM
Thank you to everyone for your input thus far. It is greatly appreciated. --174.206.x.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Moshe [CA]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 1:03 PM
Were the tenants given explicit instruction about ho to care for the floors, or what NOT to do?
Tenant damages to floor (by Tom [FL]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 1:23 PM
Robert of TX, Since you did not give the tenant instructions in the lease on how to care for the floor. Then the judge may not rule in your favor of $12K.
The damage is another factor and hopefully you did a check-in list and the tenant signed it. IF not its your word against the tenants word. There were no scratches in the floor according to the landlord. However, there were scratches in the floor according to the tenant. Plus did you take date stamp pictures before tenant moved into the unit.
You can go for the total damages to the unit. However, Will the judge rule in your favor. OR If the judge rules in your favor and now you have a judgement. You can send it to collections and hope that one day the judgement will haunt your former tenant. Otherwise it will be a major tax write-off... --99.56.xx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by JB [OR]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 1:24 PM
Robert, I once had something similar to this happen when Chinese exchange students rented a house from me. They put some time of wax on the hardwood laminate. I had my handyman take a look at it. He used a floor stripper and was able to get it all off.
I charged tenants for his labor and for the floor stripper and the stuff is still in there several years later. Maybe get another couple of opinions from some people you trust. --50.45.xxx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by Tom [FL]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 1:36 PM
Robert of TX, goggle the floor manufacturer and you may find a solution to stripping the floor. There may be a youtube video as well...
Best of Success with your floor issue. If you are going to rent the house again maybe consider a vinyl floor paint to repair the scratches. OR a stain may work. Depending on your plans for the house, before you remove the floor try cleaning it and then try touch up with a matte finish paint or stain. --99.56.xx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 1:36 PM
They were not given any specific instructions on caring for the vynil floor's. Which in hindsite would have been a good thing.
They never turned in the move in checklist as per the lease, everything is assumed to be in good condition.
The floors are only a small part of damage or alterations to the house in violation of the lease agreement. They painted most of the rooms, including trim and doors jams, bathroom cabinets and so forth, in three of the bedrooms and bathrooms. As well as other issues, such as not watering and maintaining the yard as per the lease agreement and subsequent deteriorating of the lawn.
Essentially they made the house suite their taste and I believe the floors are an extension of the.
The floors are really bad and show visible marks if you role a suitcase over them.
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 1:43 PM
Thanks for the input. In addition to the quotes, I have also done alot of research. Because it is luxury vynil planks, it has wood grain texture, the wax cannot be removed from all the cracks to restore the flooring to the Matt finish. They have changed the look and feel of the floors in their application of the product. Looks bad.
Tenant damages to floor (by JR [ME]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 2:04 PM
Renting a $400k house is way out of my league, but cheese and crackers, I would not be able to face a judge with a claim that waxing a floor caused $12,000 in damage.
With the other damage you describe, you are talking about big boy court, not small claims. Around here a simple court case can easily run $25,000 in legal fees alone, and loser doesnít pay the winnerís legal fees.
You need to speak to an attorney, not well meaning strangers on the internet. --174.192.xx.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by AllyM [NJ]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 2:16 PM
Well, I use vinyl tile in my units. I use it because I can replace a tile if a tenant ruins one by dropping a hot frying pan on it or having rabbits run around on it and chew it.
The problem here is that you rented something very valuable to tenants who don't treat our stuff as we would like.
You still have an intact floor but it is not Matte finish. I think you may have to learn to live with the shine. If you are moving back in then you will have to look at it or cover it with area rugs. If you are renting it to someone else they may not care and just get some area rugs themselves.
Vinyl just is not always tough enough to handle winter boots and gravel stuck in a shoe or cleats or other things that are not smooth.
I don' think you have any kind of case here with the floor. It's still a floor although it is now shiny. Maybe you want to sue the manufacturer for selling something that doesn't hold up. --73.178.xxx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by TOM [FL]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 2:33 PM
Try Old English Scratch Cover in a closet on scratches.
Gel stain is used on vinyl clad entry doors. You may want to consider trying a gel stain in the closet area to see how well it works.
If you decide to rent the house again, consider the touch-ups on the floor. Because the next tenant may do the same thing to the floor.
Most likely the trim and door jambs were stained and now they are painted. Lets hope they used a primer over the oil paint or in due time the paint will peel.
Tenant damages to floor (by Lynda [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 2:52 PM
OK, Robert,you have to look at it this way: The new applicants will not know they are ruined matt floors--only YOU know that. And I understand you anger at the loss of that expense. But the best thing to do is make the best of it because no way any court is going to let you charge $12K for new floors. So clean them well, and rent a floor buffer and shine the he11 out of them. Maybe even paste wax them and shine like in hospitals and public bldgs.
You can probably charge then for professionally 'stripping' the floor. Yes I realize that won't make them like new but it IS money you can recoup.
The repainting walls, woodwork, and buying new vanities can all come out of the SecDep. Adding up all the costs will total more than the SD and they will still owe you. Present the acctg within the right time frame and request the amt owed. If they do not pay, you can chose to sue them in sm claims court. There is no way you are going to be a total winner on this--but you can make lemonade by charging as much as you can for the repairs that WILL be allowed.
I know you have a spec connection to this property that used to be your home. But once it is turned into a rental it has to be thought of as a rental so you have to MIND-SHIFT away from dwelling on the damage to turning to a best scenario situation. What is the best scenario you can make? --108.87.xx.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by NC INVESTOR [NC]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 3:54 PM
I do rent out houses in that price range and while the tenants are obviously high earners I have learned that is not a guarantee that they will take care of the property.
I always require 2 months security deposit which is the most we are allowed by law in NC.
I have zero knowledge of TX LL/tenant laws nor how they handle tenant damage. I can only offer a perspective of how it would be handled in NC.
Depending on the type of flooring it is depreciated over time. Glue down flooring is considered permanent and is given 27.5 years. Removable flooring i.e. tacked down carpet is 5 years. Plank flooring would fall in the same category as carpet since it is not glued down. In NC if I installed new flooring i.e. carpet and a tenant lived there for 2 years and the carpet is damaged beyond repair I could claim 60% of the cost of the labor and materials.
Assuming TX has similar laws the most you could recoup is $7,200.00. Since it was originally your personal residence the flooring was most likely installed before you rented it out. Those years would count towards depreciable years thereby lessening your claim.
I assume this is your only rental. Are you thinking of renting it out again? Do you think it looks so bad that prospective tenants would not want to rent the house in this condition or is it more that you know what they should look like and consider them unacceptable.
I do think you might have a problem suing them for the full extent of the damage since you didn't provide instructions for caring for the floors.
If I were you I would talk to an attorney that specializes in LL/tenant law to learn about all of your options.
Tenant damages to floor (by Deanna [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 4:51 PM
Unauthorized painting should be pretty straightforward-- the cost of getting your guy to put it back the way it needs to be. I usually spend about $400-$500 for a handyguy to paint a 1000-sf house white-on-white... if you've got three times the space, plus wall color, trim color, ceiling color, and professional painters, plus any primer (especially if they painted dark colors) and, what, 2-3 gallons of paint per room... That's serious money right there.
For the yard stuff, we're in Texas. Unless you're in the Houston/Galveston/Beaumont part of the world, where you can't stop stuff from growing, if you want to keep a landscaped yard looking like a magazine, you need to hire the maintenance out to a yard care company, and build their fee into your rent. In my town, when it's 100-110*, 99% of us let our grass go dormant in the summer. It looks brown and crunchy and ugly, with green patches in the shade, but it comes back when things get rainy again. There are maybe two or three people in town who go through the trouble of keeping it green and lush year-round... but you can bet they're not tenants. :) --96.46.xxx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 4:56 PM
This has all been great advice and I appreciate all the input. Will likely talk to an attorney. If it were a simple rental, would just make the best of the floors for a new tenant. As we are moving back in, making due is what I am trying to avoid with as little pain as possible. --174.206.x.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Small potatoes [NY]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 5:07 PM
Could you steam clean the floor? Tenants and mopping is the weak link in my pinion. I gave the first tenant of my fire apt a bottle of rejuvenate hw floor cleaner for the allure. I have a tenant who ruined a bathroom floor by leaving his wet mop to dry on the floor. Just one of many examples of tenant, mopping damage --66.87.xxx.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by AllyM [NJ]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 6:14 PM
If the "two flooring experts" were floor covering dealers, they may be lying to you in the hopes of getting work. I used a wax remover to fix my mom's linoleum years ago as she had used that cleaner wax that just builds up with layers of dirt I got the wax stripper and cleaned it right down to it's original "matte" finish. It's in hardware stores in a plastic bottle that used to be beige. --73.178.xxx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by NC INVESTOR [NC]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 6:48 PM
Since you are thinking about moving back in you might want to consider an insurance claim. Did you change your insurance policy or notify your ins. company that you were renting the property? If so you may be covered.
Or you can do what my late aunt once did. She hated the result of her decorator designed living room. She figured my uncle wouldn't be inclined to give her a do over so she placed a 4' step ladder in the middle of the living room climbed to the top step with a 5 gallon bucket of clorox and "accidentally" dropped the bucket in the middle of the room. Claimed the housekeeper lost her balance while cleaning the chandelier. --71.75.xx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert J [CA]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 7:12 PM
Because of this issue, from owning just a hand held "spinner" I then purchased a floor push "spinner". It attaches to my pressure washer and wet vacuum. I can apply anywhere from 500 psi to 3000 psi and as the water is applied my wet vacuum extracts the water. I use around 1200 psi with a 32 gallon wet vac with a pump and garden hose so that I can keep on working without manually emptying the vacuum. The hotter the water the better the results. Most pressure washer can't handle over 105 degrees, which will still work fine. Or you can call a professional carpet/floor cleaning company to do the job for you. I would test a small area before giving them the go ahead to do the whole job. Like a $50 fee to test 1 small room before paying a few hundred dollars for their service. Good luck. --47.156.xx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by Robert [TX]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 7:21 PM
I like the outside the box thinking. Have a couple of closets I can test it in. --174.206.x.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by cjo,'h [CT]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 8:16 PM
Like Dr.Mike said,very foolish renting a house of that marketable value to any tenant.if you wanted to try out the Landlording business,you should have bough another reasonable priced house in a working class neighborhood,Taking that to court for $12,000,most judges would laugh you out of their chambers,even a liberal minded one........charlie........................... --174.199.x.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Tom [FL]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 8:26 PM
Small potatoes of NY had mentioned using a steam cleaner on the floor. It's a great idea and I have used a steam cleaner on my own click vinyl floors. However, in the last week I read an article that mentioned its not a good idea to use a steam cleaner on the click vinyl due to the excessive heat. Unfortunately I did not copy the article and save it. Just be careful when using heat on the click vinyl flooring.
The only thing I use on the click vinyl floors is water and white vinegar. HOWEVER I am not so sure that will cut into the wax that was put on the floor. MAYBE use a wax floor stripper/cleaner. NOT the stripper for furniture but there is a wax stripper for vinyl floors. Try a closet for a test area.
Tenant damages to floor (by cjo'h [CT]) Posted on: Jul 7, 2018 8:27 PM
Monsieur Robert,you may be able to get rid of some of the scratches by getting colour pensils at Home Depot.....charlie........................................ --174.199.x.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Vee [OH]) Posted on: Jul 8, 2018 5:17 AM
I would get an estimate to sand, seal, light stain and varnish the floor, it will take time to get thru the finish layers (need 3 or more to make it glow), this is what I do with original build hardwoods from the 50's housing - my pic page shows a project done over 10 years ago. --76.188.xxx.xx
Tenant damages to floor (by RathdrumGal [ID]) Posted on: Jul 8, 2018 7:39 AM
Robert, I understand how angry you are when someone ruins a house you care about.
Use my turnover trick. When facing a turnover that is going to be a lot of work, first I calculate all the rental income this tenant had paid me in rental income. At $2,500 a month for 24 months, you earned $60K. If you rented out the house for three years, you earned $90K. Keep that in mind. The turnover gets easier.
Tenant damages to floor (by Nellie [ME]) Posted on: Jul 8, 2018 6:29 PM
I agree that the flooring specialists may just be wanting to get a floor replacement job.
Hands and knees with a scrub brush and neutral floor cleaner cleaned the Allure (vinyl floor with texture) that the tenant had used a Mop and Glo type product on. These products will put a temporary shine on the floor, but also cause the floor to keep the dirt in all the crevices. Or a floor wax remover. I suspect that it was some sort of liquid wax that was used. --64.222.xxx.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Hoosier [IN]) Posted on: Jul 8, 2018 7:36 PM
I have not read all the posts so I'm sorry if this is redundant...but I wonder about applying an ADDITIONAL coating on top of the existing glossy one that makes it look matte? Not sure what you'd try...yikes...maybe talk to an artist and ask them how to get a matte glazing to stick to a waxed surface. --99.92.xxx.xxx
Tenant damages to floor (by Sisco [MO]) Posted on: Jul 9, 2018 6:58 AM
I am of the same opinion as small potatoes. Stripping wax from floor covering is a common occurrence. I would contact a Janitorial company and hire them to strip wax, then replace those scratched vinyl planks. Bill the former tenant.
If stripping the wax isn't going to work, it should quickly be apparent and then proceed with the full replacement option. I think it will work.
I feel that if you take this step along with your expert opinions, you will prevail in court and get a judgement.