Confess your sins ?
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Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Jan 11, 2018 1:58 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Barbara [VA]) Jan 11, 2018 2:46 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Jan 11, 2018 3:21 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by David [KY]) Jan 11, 2018 3:43 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Jan 11, 2018 3:50 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by gevans [SC]) Jan 11, 2018 3:53 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by gevans [SC]) Jan 11, 2018 3:55 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Jan 11, 2018 4:07 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by David [KY]) Jan 11, 2018 4:34 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by David [KY]) Jan 11, 2018 4:43 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by gevans [SC]) Jan 11, 2018 5:17 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Vee [OH]) Jan 11, 2018 5:25 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by RB [MI]) Jan 11, 2018 6:12 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Jan 11, 2018 6:16 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by S i d [MO]) Jan 11, 2018 6:17 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Pat [VA]) Jan 11, 2018 6:38 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by David [MI]) Jan 11, 2018 6:51 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by plenty [MO]) Jan 11, 2018 7:13 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by WMH [NC]) Jan 11, 2018 7:18 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by tryan [MA]) Jan 11, 2018 7:34 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Homer [TX]) Jan 11, 2018 7:39 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Alan [CA]) Jan 11, 2018 8:35 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by cjo'h [CT]) Jan 11, 2018 9:00 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by AllyM [NJ]) Jan 11, 2018 9:09 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by BRAD 20,000 [IN]) Jan 11, 2018 11:32 AM
       Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Jan 11, 2018 12:13 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by NE [PA]) Jan 11, 2018 12:39 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by Robert Phaedra [NY]) Jan 11, 2018 1:02 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by Robert,Ontario,Can [ON]) Jan 11, 2018 2:02 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by GKARL [PA]) Jan 11, 2018 3:33 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by Mickie [OH]) Jan 11, 2018 3:50 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by Nicole [PA]) Jan 11, 2018 6:40 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by cjo'h [CT]) Jan 11, 2018 7:25 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by Amy [MO]) Jan 11, 2018 8:38 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by WMH [NC]) Jan 12, 2018 2:14 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by Ray-N-Pa [PA]) Jan 12, 2018 3:27 PM
       Confess your sins ? (by Janet [KY]) Jan 25, 2018 7:12 PM

Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 1:58 AM

I am not referring to a religious confession here, but I am referring to all of things we sometimes do at rental properties that we would never do at the house we call home.

For example,..instead of spending hours scrubbing down dirty nicotine stained walls, I have been known to just paint over it and be done with it. Yes, it is sinful but it is what it is.

Instead of fixing something the correct way (which could take you hours and X number of dollars),..have you ever done a quick fix? I am referring to putting lipstick on a pig here. Yes, I am guilty of this too.

Okay, my confession is over and I feel better now. Who is brave enough to be next?

Confess your sins ? (by Barbara [VA]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 2:46 AM

I wouldn't even know where to start. Stick and peel tiles for flooring? Stick and peel tiles to freshen up the appearance of old dated cabinets. I could go on. But, I am 1000% guilty of doing things I would never do to my own home.

Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 3:21 AM


Peel and stick tiles is minor. I would not even call that sinful. I am referring to serious rehab repairs, not calling a plumber and instead using duct tape to stop a water leak. And with sub-floors that reek with cat urine, just painting over it instead of replacing the sub-floor.

Confess your sins ? (by David [KY]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 3:43 AM

Never getting a permit............for anything. --196.52.xx.xx

Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 3:50 AM

David (KY)

I have to ask,...what type of permit was required and why didn't you get it? Permits are not that expensive.

Confess your sins ? (by gevans [SC]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 3:53 AM

What David said! LOL

How about adding a second layer of tongue and groove subfloor on top of the existing, rotted subfloor...without removing a single piece.

How about patching 6 inches of PEX in a supply line under a sink... between CPVC and copper? Because that's what I had in the box. --98.122.x.xx

Confess your sins ? (by gevans [SC]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 3:55 AM


It's not the price of the permit. It's putting up with the inspector. He will destroy your schedule and demand stupid things that are NOT in the code book, costing big $$$. --98.122.x.xx

Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 4:07 AM


In my town, a plumbing permit is required just to install an electric water heater. When you get caught without a permit, the city will fine you severely. All rental houses are inspected here on a yearly basis and when the inspector sees a new water heater (or whatever), he then goes looking for the required permit. My plumber pulls a permit for any new installation he does for me.

Confess your sins ? (by David [KY]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 4:34 AM

Roy I never get a permit for anything. Build a deck, nope. Extend a roof, nope. Deck roofs, nope. Fences, no. All new electrical and circuits, nah. Swap out all plumbing and reroute, nah. Load bearing walls, yawn. Reroute whole hvac systems, nah. Etc etc. Different window sizes installs, sewer lines, totally different entry door and sizes. Nope, nope and nope.

We hide all the materials/scrap in the backyard of the project house or garage if it has one. Sometimes it takes me months to throw out all the trash on small bulk pickups because I only get a dumpster if it is impossible for me to throw out all the trash myself. I pretty much have a bulk pickup every week for the first 3 months of every project. I make sure Craigslist guys also pickup all my scrap after 5pm-6pm so we never get caught. --196.52.xx.xx

Confess your sins ? (by David [KY]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 4:43 AM

Roy, so far there are no inspections on annual rental properties for me, thank goodness. When I go to a Home Depot to buy a Hot Water Heater they ask me for to fill out some sort of info card and I look at them and say ehhh "No". So far they just smile and never bother me about it. I'm sure this cannot last forever. --196.52.xx.xx

Confess your sins ? (by gevans [SC]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 5:17 AM

Roy, I'm shocked and surprised that any small town in AL has requirements like that.

So far, we are safe in the rural areas of SC. Permits and inspections are sometimes required, but only if they know about it.

Same as David. I have pulled fewer than 5 permits in my 40 years of construction projects. Each time I pulled a permit I lived to regret it. The inspectors don't go by the code book, they go by "I think". You can't possibly predict what an inspector will think, so how do you pass on the first try? Easier to just work after hours and on weekends.

I also keep materials out of sight and clean up every day.


Confess your sins ? (by Vee [OH]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 5:25 AM

I have skipped a few permits but not skipped the quality of work, been caught many times and when I go downtown the green sticker is attached to my permit cause the work was fine just the formality of the paperwork. I did once put in a combo smoke alarm/co detector at the request of the fire chief because I asked the inspector if the smoke goes up and the co goes low which location would be effective for a combo unit that he told me I -needed- in order to pass - I told him I should just leave it on the kitchen counter with a cord but he never answered my question about where, I did install a co detector on the wall and a smoke on the ceiling when the chief came back he saw them but said -it is code to have the combo- but agreed they really need to be separate detectors.

Confess your sins ? (by RB [MI]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 6:12 AM

Getting back to the (Original) question, (drifting)

I have been known to Patch a Roof using a

New Roof Shingle and Tar, right over existing. (repair)

Other than Pilots flying over the place,

who's Gonna see it ?

After a few years of the Checker Board look,

We climb up their and Tear off / replace, everything.

It's only Cosmetic ! --47.35.xx.xx

Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 6:16 AM


You and I both know that permits are mostly a 'money grab' for any city's coffers. My city just needs more money than yours does! And here the most incompetent inspectors are the HUD/Section 8 inspectors. I had one Section 8 inspection in which the inspector counted the number of water drops (in 5 seconds) after the tub faucet handle was turned off. After 5 seconds, if one additional drop came out, that failed the inspection. I am not kidding.

Confess your sins ? (by S i d [MO]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 6:17 AM

What's funny here is you assume I DON'T do these kinds of things at my own house! ;-)

Alright, so most times I don't...but I've duct taped a few things together to hold something until I can get it done "right".

The kinds of "sins" you're talking about are in the eye of the beholder. What's wrong with painting over a nicotine stained wall? If it works and the tenants are okay with it...then what's the problem? Smokers suck nicotine directly into their lungs day in and day is having a painted over wall making their lives or health any worse? And yes, probably 2/3 of my tenant smoke..."outdoors only" of course! ;-)

What I would consider a "sin" is if something was dangerous and I tried to cover it up with a cheap band-aid that left the tenant in a potentially unsafe situation. Water heater installation, for example, is one area I think code has overreached greatly. It is a simple plumbing fix that a competent handyman or even a reasonably good DIY homeowner should be able to do in 1-2 hours. I've swapped out probably half a dozen myself back in the day before I hired maintenance done. 10 years later, they're still going strong and have zero problems. All you need is a few basic tools and a gas "sniffer" or some soapy water to test the safety of the gas line. If no gas or water leaks observed, you should be good to go!

So, guess I need you to identify some "worse sins" before I can comment further.

Confess your sins ? (by Pat [VA]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 6:38 AM

I confess for my DH that he avoids permits because he dislikes being jerked around by officials. He refused to buy a property in the local county seat because there were too many eyes to contend with. He & his handyman do good work but I guess they like a little freedom to choose.

Some of these stories are shocking, like counting the dang drips..... really.

Confess your sins ? (by David [MI]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 6:51 AM

Other than lightly wipe a wall to remove ddust and other loose debris, I don't see why it would be necessary to scrub down a wall that you're going to using a strong primer to cover.

Confess your sins ? (by plenty [MO]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 7:13 AM

Mirror over holes! Just hang it up there and go to lunch! Plastic trim in rentals. Once put up cork board over hole in kitchen wall, ok twice, called it a feature family message center. Had dessert before lunch with that one! --66.87.xx.xx

Confess your sins ? (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 7:18 AM

We pull permits in rentals before we would our own home LOL! We installed a stairway in our home which required MAJOR reconstruction of the ceiling/floor (we replaced a set of circular stairs with a real staircase.) It is well constructed, much safer than the circular steps and looks great but it would never pass code because it ends at a slightly slanted wall at the bottom (A-frame house.) In order to get the rise we wanted (as small as possible, 6") this is how it had to be. It also sticks in the living room a little bit at too low of an angle.

A tall person needs to watch their head (read: my husband and all of my sons.) But they are not idiots and no one has banged their heads once. Just walk a bit further over.

In a rental this would not fly.

Things we are certainly "guilty" of doing is painting old gross paneling, nicotined walls and cabinets...but mostly we try to make the rentals as good as our own home without any high-end finishes and cheaper appliances.

Confess your sins ? (by tryan [MA]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 7:34 AM

No permits ... guilty as charged. The last tub I replace I had a partner in crime ... my plumber agreed to do the job on the weekend.

How 'bout stickers to cover holes in the storms before a S8 inspection. And normally I would simply REMOVE the storm for the inspection. Bigger stickers for holes in the hallow doors.

Towing abandon cars into the street ... another favorite.

I could go on and on ... turning on the heat in my name for the day of an inspection ... off the next day. You should see them scramble for the HOT shower.

Confess your sins ? (by Homer [TX]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 7:39 AM

Roy! This ainít Sunday school, where confession of your sins is good. Well, I have never put Bondo on exterior wood trim just to get another 7-8 years out of wood. I have never changed hot waters out without a permit, never covered a new hot water heater with radiant barrier so the rental inspector wouldnít notice itís a new hw heater, I have never put dust and dryer lint on the top of a hw heater to make it look like itís been there for years. I have never floated a floor instead of having foundation work done. I have never put roll roofing over an attached back porch that was leaking. I have never just used Kilz on a ceiling and no paint because the kilz looked good when dried. No sir, I have never taken a short cut on any house I own.....

Confess your sins ? (by Alan [CA]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 8:35 AM

None that I disclose!

Confess your sins ? (by cjo'h [CT]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 9:00 AM

Father Roy, "Bless me Father,"Didn't know you have been ordained,Had I known,I would definitely have gone to Alabama for the occasion.Especially with the God awful weather we've had here.below 0* temperatures.Coming from the North of Ireland and getting a good grounding in how something should be done,there are no shortcuts,either do it right or don't do it at all.Takes the same length of time to do it properly.As far as permits,I'm with David.The only permits I've gotten was for new construction.When you see some of the inspectors and know their background,that tells it all.One guy was originally a stakeout man for a company ,stakeout where building was supposed to go.Even got that wrong a few times.couldn't hit the nail with a hammer.Pathetic?So Father Roy!Again Welcome.........charlie..............................................................

Confess your sins ? (by AllyM [NJ]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 9:09 AM

My home needs work inside like paint and a few more grounded outlets. The rentals are perfect. Shoemaker's children go barefoot. I get the required permits because to not do it would slow down a sale if necessary. Yes they make me do stupid things and yes I have to wait for them for a four hour window. Generally they keep homes from burning down around here though. For example, some plumber was running around installing those on demand hot water heaters without telling people that they need to enlarge their gas pipes to make it work under high demand. Inspectors found the guy and got him. Stopped a lot of aggravation for folks.

Confess your sins ? (by BRAD 20,000 [IN]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 11:32 AM


Wifey says my sin is fixing the rentals before our own home! "Cobbler's Shoes".

That broken doodad in the kid's room (he's 35 now and been out on his own for YEARS!) does not make a difference but the broken doodad in a rental gets fixed because that's the Money Making Machine! contributing to my FREEDOM!!!

Repairs at home don't help me be FREE.


Confess your sins ? (by Roy [AL]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 12:13 PM


All I wanted to know is, YOU have any Class C rehab 'skeletons in your closet'? :) I would agree, most sins are in the eye of the beholder.

Whenever I buy a $5,000 house, I have to deal with the sins of the previous owners and let me tell you, the list of sins is sometimes endless. I have rebuild things (to code) that someone obviously did not get a permit to build,..usually it is an addition to the back of the house. Floor joist that should be 16 inches on center,..are actually 32 inches apart. I have seen windows that were installed upside down! Electrical slices made with no junction boxes or with wire nuts or black tape on them. Just twist the wires together and let it be.

Charlie - My father was an ordained Methodist minister at one time until he got caught doing something he should not have done. Hey, no one is perfect.

Confess your sins ? (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 12:39 PM

Brad, dishes and laundry at home don't help me be free either.

Confess your sins ? (by Robert Phaedra [NY]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 1:02 PM

Lay sale or clearance flooring vinyl on top of outdated kitchen countertops. Trim with pre-painted wood from the big box store. Huge improvement over dated ugly stuff, and cheap. If it gets worn or damaged, put on another layer.

Confess your sins ? (by Robert,Ontario,Can [ON]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 2:02 PM

Cutting costs was not option where annual operating costs were going more then allowed rent increases allowed under the rent control which was designed not to control rents but bankrupt private sector rental housing providers. So had out of necessity had to do two things diametrically opposed one continue to do repairs, renovations while cut every single operating cost which could be cut. First off extended the pick ups for the garbage disposal by compressing down garbage where fewer pick ups during the year. Set up programming on dryer which gave fewer minutes on dry time then reduce temperature a bit down where the amount natural gas was reduced. Shopped frequently at the Habitat for Humanity restores where visit different stores for supplies. Bought new second interior doors which were destroyed by tenants along other types of doors. Bought new end of the line ceramic or porcelain tiles where a bathroom there always enough tiles. Went in the back of store then bought drywall for $5 dollar a sheet where the edges were damaged. Bought pre mixed miss tint paint as well as with a few cans of white was always able to mix a 20 liter bucket. Screened out a lot of lower end tenants as raised the score to over 700 which avoided a lot of the tenants who trashed out rental units. Used ceiling fans, light fixtures can always be made to work. Bought only used appliances on the internet as the average life of a appliance was 3 to 5 years then took to scrap metal place along other scrap metal. When a apartment was trashed out separated out what could be donated charities then what was not recyclable or unusable was taken to the dump. In province of Ontario it is impossible to supply a lower rental unit as the operating costs with damages and arrears will break you. Private rental housing providers are not social agency where some of the government owned complexes are losing over $100,000 a year after rent is collect but they say that is affordable rental housing as someone is not making a profit. Those profiteers are referred as pigs by the extreme left wing tenancy advocate groups. Why not sell your houses then let people live rent free. Come on lets show a example.

Confess your sins ? (by GKARL [PA]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 3:33 PM

Is this string about a confession of past sins or the ones you're getting ready to commit?

Confess your sins ? (by Mickie [OH]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 3:50 PM

Gevans and David, Like you I donít mess with permits. The quality of the work is the same - I donít scrimp on safety or quality where it counts. For me itís a matter of principle. The less any form of city government is in my life the better. Iíve moved interior wall, my contractor has built a front porch & roofed it, my electrician never pulls a permit. The only time Iíve every gone through the permit and in this case deposit process was when I had a 100 yr old stone retaining wall let go and I hired a company to remove the stone and build another wall.

Confess your sins ? (by Nicole [PA]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 6:40 PM

... I have seen windows that were installed upside down...

I bought a place one time that had a double hung window ... but it was sideways in the wall like a slider

Confess your sins ? (by cjo'h [CT]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 7:25 PM

Roy,I'm sure you're father was a good man,getting caught was more of a sin! So don't get caught.charlie............................................................... ........ --174.199.x.xx

Confess your sins ? (by Amy [MO]) Posted on: Jan 11, 2018 8:38 PM

Same as plenty-mirrors over holes. Touch-up paint that doesn't quite match the original color vs painting the whole thing or two tone paint where bottom half is painted different color than top on purpose so we don't have to paint the top half which hardly ever has anything wrong w it. Turning a shade the other way so I don't have to clean it right then(like just before a showing and you just saw one you forgot). Cheapie light bulbs(if there is such a thing anymore) Have put a security sticker over a bullethole in a window to put off fixing it right away. (Between tenants)

Confess your sins ? (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Jan 12, 2018 2:14 PM

DEFINITELY have covered holes with mirrors, bulletin boards, magnetic white boards...but those are FEATURES not sins.

Confess your sins ? (by Ray-N-Pa [PA]) Posted on: Jan 12, 2018 3:27 PM

Help me father Jeffery for I have sinned........

I have been known in the past to get to busy working in the business that I didn't work ON the business.

I have also been not clear enough in explaining exactly what is expected by contractors.

I have not been always been clear enough in explaining what exactly is an emergency

Confess your sins ? (by Janet [KY]) Posted on: Jan 25, 2018 7:12 PM

Avoiding permits.

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