I have a couple that recently applied. I have for several days tried to turn them down, unsuccessfully. I have tried to be nice. I am concerned about fair housing. They are new to this county (husband here 1 year, wife 2) & minority.

These are my concerns:

Wife wanted to know if I was going to replace the cabinets. First complaint ever about the cabinets (they are fine) I heard “ I am going to be a PITA”. I give them an application & review criteria. Which includes (short list)

-VERIFIABLE INCOME, paycheck STUBS

credit /criminal check

HOME INSPECTION

Signs of stability i.e. 2+ years same job, residence etc.

They send over an incomplete application ….so signature authorizing a credit report. Maybe an oversight, I think ‘convenient’ forget so I can’t run/use credit report against them. Report income of $4000 +

I inform them application is incomplete, need signed application. My plan I to get the application info & then send them a link to cozy to run the report. I want the application info first so I have it for my records as this was going to be my first time using COZY (not sure what the report would look like). Sends over signed application, but now income is $8000 + month & wife’s income is $4000. Sends over Feb & march paycheck copies for one company and paystub with year to date info for another. Sends over emails about payments from Amazon as verification of wife’s income. I call the phone number printed on the paycheck copy he has provided. They tell me he is a driver and rents a van from them. But he got into an accident several weeks ago & there is some ‘problem’ and he has not worked for them since.

I contact applicant and repeatedly ask for paycheck stubs from companies. He goes on about how can use all this other stuff for verification. I know he is a problem and I want to avoid a confrontation. Never would I want an ongoing landlord tenant relationship with this guy/family. The insistent attitude about how I should verify the application process and nonstop emails about how they are awaiting their approval is too much for me! I tell him the application is incomplete and they need to run a credit report. I am hoping the credit report will be bad. Well they have what is known as VERY thin credit …in they have been in the county a short period of time and have 2 accounts which they pay on time. Have managed to run up $10,000 in credit card debt in their short time in the county, but they are making the payments. On the COZY credit report he now indicates his monthly income is $18,000.

So this is a guy who ‘income’ basically doubles with each application (incomplete application - $4000+, complete application $8000+, COZY application for credit report $18,000). A company he shows as an employer has said he hasn’t worked there in weeks.

I have gently tried to reject him 3 times now. There is a flurry of emails and text with him indicating that there is ‘constancy’ in his applications, but his monthly income varies and more than covers the rent. He will provide bank statements, etc for me to use as verification. He contradicts the company indicating that he is a contract driver for the company and once the car is fixed will start working there again.

I want to be sure I ‘reject’ him and there is NO fair housing issues for me. He is going to be a pain about this….I have already rejected him 3 times. How do you say NO to folks who don’t want to hear NO.

Reject! Even if he had the whole DoJ at his beck and call with hundreds of lawyers and unlimited resources. HONESTY is a criteria. 3 different answers, deviating by 100%? H*ll no!

Replacing the cabinets? A missed opportunity to draw a line in the sand.

Care to share their national origin?

In addition, the guy cannot prove that he is even employed RIGHT NOW: (I made good money working for Mercedes in the 1980s, but last month's pay stub would be more relevant, wouldn't it?)

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Relax. They blew it. This is not a place where one can buy as many lottery tickets as one wants.

Q1: what is your income? $ 4 k, $ 8 k or $ 18 k? Lies lead to disqualification.

Q2: Ask for the last 2 months' pay stubs and whether he has been working the last few weeks?

It's obvious that wife doesn't even like the apartment.

Laura, I would print out a copy of your above posting and keep it in this tenant file. You have beautifully documented the inconsistent stories, incomplete application, and inability to verify employment. Keep all of the incomplete applications and weird pay stubs. So what if they go to Fair Housing? As long as you can show that you consistently apply your applicant criteria across all applicants, you should be fine. These are desperate liars -- they are not squeaky clean applicants.

No one but you knows that you were going to try Cozy with this vacancy. Just keep the application where they did not sign to allow the credit check under your old system. These are probably not the best applicants to institute a change in systems, since your defense is YOUR consistent applicant screening process. This is why I keep all of our applicant screening forms -- even for the no-shows and the for the folks that don't return apps.

Based on your description, "They are new to this country" please remember in some cultures they believe everything is negotiable. You just need to continue following your established criteria and move on to the next candidate.

I agree with the comments here.

Take a step back and realize, the problems you are facing now are small compared to what will happen once you rent to them.

Literally......dont open that door.

I think they see you as a target and they are trying to wear you down.

Their info is inconsistent. Document everything that has happened, times, dates conversations.

Laura this is so unlike you. what gives? You wrote a book and you don't even have a good app from them---- who has time for this drama? not you.

Answer is I've moved on to the next applicant who has filled out the application properly "SORRY".

We found one trick -- let them know that another app fee is due when each item is changed so it can be re verified.

renton PA-- "negotiable" or it's OK to lie? big different.

A couple of things:

- as always thanks for the thoughts

- the answer is document and move on

- I wrote a book?????? How was it? What was the title???????

Strike one: complaints.

Strike Two: incomplete application

Strike Three: inconsistent information.

You do not have to be a PI to determine this is a NO. You are worried about fair housing. But is it fair to other "typical" applicants who do not get more than one chance to screw up until they are rejected? You have a system-just follow it with consistency for everyone. Time is passing- get someone in whose application is complete and will take it as is.

"They are new to this country" please remember in some cultures they believe everything is negotiable.

But....they are here now and get to play by the rules n this country.

Laura I meant your post was like a book------- long and drawn out.

This situation has been bothering me & i have to say socializing this issue with the board has been helpful.

Your making a mountain out of a molehill.

You received an incomplete application. Inform them what they need to complete it, if they don't complete it deny for incomplete application unable to process.

All application fees are none refundable.

I dont think Laura is making a mountain out of a mole hill.

The problem is (at least in ontario), the human rights commission PRESUMES the accused party is guilty and the onus is on the party to prove their innocence to the satisfaction of the far left leaning commission.

These bodies dont use common sense in making judgements.

Laura,

I learned at a past Convention: DO NOT WRITE ON THE ORIGINAL APPLICATION!

We date stamp it and make a copy to write notes on.

Make certain you can locate this incomplete application 2 years from now if they file a complaint.

I realize you may be a bit insecure about discrimination complaints but I think you are OK.

It's usually their SPOKEN or TEXTED words that get LLs in trouble. So stop talking to them!

(also be aware this might be a tester)

Me? Stop answering their calls and responding to emails/texts. You'll get about 4 more before they move on.

Position: incomplete application. Done. "We will be happy to review a completed application."

Have their emails as back up.

Hustle and get it rented to a normal person without drama who is ready to be a good resident. Spend your precious life on finding a good one rather than tap dancing with a bad one.

BRAD

Incomplete application

False/inconsistent information on application

Unable to verify income

Unable to verify employment

Unable to verify credit

Unable to meet your stability requirements with job Unable to meet your stability requirements with residence

You have created rental criteria to be consistent with acceptance or rejecting applicants. Following this guideline every time will ensure you apply criteria fairly to all applicants. You should not be passing it out to applicants as they can use it to lie on the application or they can use it against you in a fair housing lawsuit. Only bring it out if required by subpoena as you have given a lawyer ammunition. Having copies in the community also makes it difficult to change or update it.

Past experience with a certain race should not be part of the decision process in accepting or rejecting an applicant. These applicants did not meet your written requirements on multiple items. As they don't meet your written criteria it should be easy for you to decide to reject. Anything other than reject violates your written criteria which means you are inconsistent which can open you up to a fair housing lawsuit. You will have less drama when you follow your criteria and learn to say "NO" firmly without confusing an applicant trying to be gentle.

Laura, if you are still worried, give them one last change (or more rope): make them fill out the application once again. With their now 4th choice regarding monthly income.

Then VERIFY that income. What matters is the present time, not some glorious past.

Quick! What's the amout again? $ 4 k, $ 8 k or $ 18 k?!?

LIARS can blame themselves for blowing it, just like in an application for ordinary credit. Or in life.

Good applicants need not act that desperate. Next.