Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Apr 9, 2017 12:22 PM|
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by NE [PA]) Apr 9, 2017 12:23 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Apr 9, 2017 12:32 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Still Learning [NH]) Apr 9, 2017 12:44 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Moshe [CA]) Apr 9, 2017 1:51 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Kyle [IN]) Apr 9, 2017 1:57 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Amy [MO]) Apr 9, 2017 2:32 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Deanna [TX]) Apr 9, 2017 2:44 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by plenty [MO]) Apr 9, 2017 2:54 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Ed [PA]) Apr 9, 2017 2:57 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Stephen [ON]) Apr 9, 2017 3:12 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Gary [OK]) Apr 9, 2017 3:37 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Robert,Ontario,Can1 [ON]) Apr 9, 2017 3:43 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by RR78 [VA]) Apr 9, 2017 5:48 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Smokowna [MD]) Apr 9, 2017 7:47 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Apr 9, 2017 7:56 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Robert J [CA]) Apr 9, 2017 8:23 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by BRAD 20,000 [IN]) Apr 9, 2017 10:16 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by myob [GA]) Apr 10, 2017 4:50 AM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by S i d [MO]) Apr 10, 2017 5:16 AM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by S i d [MO]) Apr 10, 2017 5:32 AM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Moshe [CA]) Apr 10, 2017 9:22 AM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Apr 10, 2017 11:24 AM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Richard [MI]) Apr 10, 2017 1:15 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by gevans [SC]) Apr 10, 2017 1:40 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Apr 10, 2017 3:42 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Apr 11, 2017 4:16 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by TA [CA]) Apr 13, 2017 12:43 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Laura [SC]) Apr 13, 2017 1:50 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Ray-N-Pa [PA]) Apr 13, 2017 7:15 PM
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by RR78 [VA]) Apr 14, 2017 6:38 AM
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Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 12:22 PM
Guys, I need some help. I have a tenant who claimed their hot water heater was malfunctioning. I live out of town and brutally dislike the tenants in question, so I try to avoid them at all costs (dumb, I know but they are a royal pain in my arse). Anyways.. fast forward to now.. they claimed they would replace it and deduct from rent. I asked for receipts and was provided (after a week of requesting) a handwritten "work order receipt". The tenant does AC repairs so, it was given on the same paperwork as he did some ac work on before. I have bought and installed hot water heaters AND had plumbers come out. Should I accept this "receipt"? I have already asked for the original receipts for the purchase of the heater AND supplies. Knowing a 50 gal HWH is around $400 and he isn't an actual plumber.. I have a bill for $850... I just don't buy that for a minute. I had a smaller lowboy installed in a hard to access storage closet and it costed me $700. I have told hkm until I get the receipts for the actual HWH and supplies I'm not accepting it. Am I in the wrong? Or should I stand my ground that this is Bullcrap? --174.193.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 12:23 PM
Not only would I not accept that, I wouldn't have allowed the repair to take place like this. --50.107.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 12:32 PM
I planned on doing it myself but, after having 2 plumbers flake on me, I am a single mom with 2 small kids and live 2 hours away and couldnt get down there.. I feel like I'm being majorly scammed and they have 10 months of a lease left, when they leave I wi be stuck with this hot water heater, so if it is "mine" I want the warranty and everything else incase it fails in 11 months. I should have done it myself, but this month didn't really have many options. I didn't want them reporting me to some Housing Authority for "unsafe living conditions". --174.193.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Still Learning [NH]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 12:44 PM
I wouldn't use them again, but if you do either get a quote ahead of time or pay rent and bill you for the job. $850 is over the threshold and should get a 1099. --24.61.xxx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Moshe [CA]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 1:51 PM
YOU accepted their offer to replace the heater and to deduct from rent. If there are no more details to the agreement, then it is your responsibility to impeach their claim of $850.
Apparently, your agreement did not put any limits on the transaction, nor was payment even dependent on any documentation.
Maybe you can request details of where they purchased the heater, and hours of labor (so that you can calculate charge per hour labor). If the tenant was able to purchase the heater at wholesale (because he is in AC business) he is entitled to sell it to you at retail, plus a reasonable charge for his labor.
Next time, either arrange for your own service, or make a more professional agreement.
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Kyle [IN]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 1:57 PM
When you made the repair and deduct agreement, was it clear how much you would allow them to deduct? If you left it open, you may be stuck with the bill. $850 is high, but not abnormal for a big HVAC/Plumbing company. --68.38.xxx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Amy [MO]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 2:32 PM
I'm sorry this is happening to you. Some tenants, yes, will create work and if you have agreed, send you the bill in order to avoid paying rent.
1. They need to produce the receipts, along with photos of what was wrong and what's new for your records. You need warranty and user manuals and receipts in case something goes wrong. $850 is high. For that he should provide a good warranty on his labor, as well.
2. Have a nice talk that although you are happy with the work, you will not be able to have them do anymore repairs as it is a conflict of interest. Send it in writing- a text, email, notice, but make a record that you gave it to them.
3. No more repairs done by tenants under any circumstances. Don't be afraid of your tenants. They can sense it and will take the upper hand. Even if it is a pain in your, get somebody else out there to look at any repairs that come up.
Good luck. --136.32.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Deanna [TX]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 2:44 PM
The biggest section of my lease is talking about "repairs and remedies"-- spelling out the different tenant protections that already exist under Texas State Law, regarding what to do in situations that affect the health & safety of an ordinary tenant under various circumstances, the timelines involved, the methods by which people can repair & remedy a situation, versus pursue judicial remedies, versus etc, etc, etc.
You can Google for "Texas State Bar lease" and see the bones of what I use--- obviously I've modified it very much, both tightening things up (late fee of 5% of an rent not received by the tenth day after it's due?! in TX, your earliest allowable late fee kicks in the day after it's due) and in adding clarifications as Experience kicks in. So you might consider this as your Experience Kicking In, and modifying future leases to address this problem very specifically.
So, one important thing is a cap. In TX, we often use "repairs may not exceed $500 or one month's rent, whichever is greater". So you've got a ceiling for repairs. You've already got the repair bill and the receipt for the payment covered. It's also important to limit who's allowed to work on it, and who's not. (Yes: someone currently advertising in the local classifieds or phone book; no: Tenant, Tenant's immediate family, Tenant's employer or employees, or a company in which Tenant has an ownership interest.) And so on and so forth.
So, if you're doing distance landlording, whether it's two states away or two hours, one of the difficulties is the loss of boots-on-the-ground. Your tenants may be the handiest people in the world, but it's not healthy to let them do their own repairs. You need to have "your" guy do the work, and "your" guy needs to be trustworthy. Go through as many plumbers as you need to before you find "your" guy. If you live in an area with a limited number of plumbers available, it's okay to stick with one until he annoys you, move on to the next, and cycle through until you've forgiven the original plumbers for their transgression. ;) Regardless of how you feel about your tenants personally, you also need to get in and get it done so that they don't step in and try and take care of it themselves. Because that's a good way to lose control fast, especially if they're deducting from rent. Don't give people you don't like ammunition to not like you back.
So-- definitely request more details, like a breakdown of the bill, and the receipts to back it up. But next time, don't hire your tenants to do your job, and don't make casual, open-ended (verbal?) agreements. --96.46.xxx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by plenty [MO]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 2:54 PM
Where i live you must have a permit to out in a water heater. Can they send you photos if the old and new units? --66.87.xx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Ed [PA]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 2:57 PM
You didn't agree to a price ahead of time, your fault. You can call any large plumbing outfit in your area and get a quote. In my area $850 for hot water tank plus install will fall within the range of quotes. If it falls within the range of quotes in your area be happy and pay your tenant, next time agree on price before work is performed. --96.236.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Stephen [ON]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 3:12 PM
Laura, the advice you have received is good but it is pretty clear that these tenants have you on the run. Try to get back in control of the relationship. Start by setting limits around the billing. I would pay a plumber to inspect the hot water heater installation so that you don't have a flood or some other disaster. --70.30.xx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Gary [OK]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 3:37 PM
Another thing you should do is find a Landlord Association or other landlords near your rental and ask for references for handyman and skilled labor for the times something needs to be taken care of before you can get there. --98.184.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Robert,Ontario,Can1 [ON]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 3:43 PM
If you went to auto repair shop for a brake job then the engine was replaced then this is a unauthorized repair. Unless the repair was authorized then I would refuse to pay. If the water heater tank is under 5 years old it is unlikely a replacement water heater tank is required. Worst case a gas valve which does not require complete replacement. Unless this stops this is going to be more unnecessary repairs like this. A complete inspection by another contractor while you are there to see what is required. --74.220.xxx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by RR78 [VA]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 5:48 PM
The repair was clearly authorized by you. So I agree with the others you should pay.
My guess is he checked on what plumbers are charging for the job and charged the same. So it would be considered reasonable.
I think if you check around you will also find the price is reasonable if you had a plumber install one.
He is entitled to the same unless a different price was part of your agreement.
Also you may even find it is more than reasonable if he bought a 12 year heater instead of a 6 year.
But you should insist on the receipt and warranty info.
There is a chance he saved you a few dollars. But then again, also a chance he could have even put in a used heater. --50.134.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Smokowna [MD]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 7:47 PM
Find a Sears contractor and see what they get paid to do the same piece work.
If it is in line with your bill, then let it ride. If you are being charged a couple hundred too much, then split the difference.
Have some reasoning to with which to debate the price. --74.96.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 7:56 PM
See, that's my concern. Is that he got one second hand and is trying to pull one over on me. I didn't necessarily approve this, as he was supposed to have a plumber do it. I only just learned he did it himself today when I recieved this receipt. It isn't broken down to include labor, supplies or anything just $850.16. I think I atleast need an actual receipt of purchase given that it wasn't a plumber or plumbing company to cover any problems that come up. I am aware of my mistakes on this, and will ensure it doesn't happen again. As i also learned 2 year leases are a horrible idea.. but, the idea of a steady tenant was tempting. With every tenant I have learned new things that I need to include in leases.. this site has been helpful though as most of you guys have lots of knowledge and experience. I am young and a woman and inherited these properties when my parents passed so, a lot of people think I'm naive but, I'm also not blind when something seems fishy. --174.193.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Robert J [CA]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 8:23 PM
I am a California Licensed Plumbing Contractor, with other construction licenses as well. In the last 35 years of being a landlord, I've had a few tenants offer to replace a "so called" defective water heater for me and deduct the "LABOR" from their rent, but not the cost of the water heater. They were going to purchase it from HOME DEPOT (with their credit card) and I would pay for the water heater. A few of my tenants are "handymen" working for other large landlords.
1. Many City, States and the Feds have passed new emission standards so water heater manufactures met those new standards by producing bad, terrible, unreliable water heaters that break down prematurely.
So 50% or more plumbers don't know how to fix these troubled units (water heaters) and just replace them to maximize on profits -- profit on the water heater, labor and parts. How is your tenant going to know if the water heater can be fixed or should be replaced? They won't.
So even if your tenant has the best of intentions, it may be a $7 part, a $35 part or a $100 part that needs replacing. SO long as the core isn't leaking water, chances are its a component issue only.
To allow a tenant to replace an expensive dangerous water heater that's hooked up to the water and gas -- is putting you in a serious liability position. If ever this water heater leaks or if there's a fire, you have no recourse -- the installer wasn't licensed to professionally trained.
Next, without a original receipt, you have NO Warranty from the Manufacture. With a receipt, it guarantee is from 6 to 15 years, depending on the model.
In every case, I believe you didn't make a good decision.
A friend, who owns a few rentals got a call from his tenant about the water heater not working. So instead of calling his friend the plumber, he allowed the tenant to install the new water heater. A slow leak from sweating the copper pipes lead to water leaking under the Hard Wood Flooring, over cement. Mold grew. Tenants got sick. Besides having to do remediation, replacing the flooring. He had to pay for his tenants to move and match the higher rent for the balance of the lease.. Cost my friend over $30,000. But he did save $150 on the labor, I would have charged that much more to do the job right. --47.156.xx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by BRAD 20,000 [IN]) Posted on: Apr 9, 2017 10:16 PM
You let this slip out of your control but all is not lost.
First, what does your lease say?
Next put EYES ON the "new" water heater. Take a photo of the serial number on the side and check the date of manufacture. Yes it could be used.
Price them at Lowes. My local Lowes' installation dept charges $275 to install. The installer gets approx half of that.
I then fall back to my policy of "We pay $100 for a WH installation."
Ive been scammed too many times with a drunk brother in law charging big company rates seeing an opportunity to gouge me.
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by myob [GA]) Posted on: Apr 10, 2017 4:50 AM
Under no circumstances may tenants do work on either their place or other rentals we have. NEVER.
Sorry but you need to take the ride it's your responsibility as owner.
All work must be requested in writing unless emergency situation.
Dump these tenants ASAP since you hate them. Your life will become bearable again. --74.184.xxx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by S i d [MO]) Posted on: Apr 10, 2017 5:16 AM
Everyone has hit most of the important stuff -- btw, I agree you're going to pay the bill on this one...it wasn't managed properly. If you can get the receipts and warranty, count yourself lucky since this is all being done after the fact.
Caveat: My intention not to beat up on you, but it must be clear that if you choose to continue being a long distance land lord, you choose to take all the work and hassles that come with it.
The one thing I haven't seen directly addressed yet is the level of personal responsibility that comes with being a land lord or business owner of any type. Here are just a few the things I'm referring to:
"I am a single mom with 2 small kids and live 2 hours away and couldnt get down there"
"I should have done it myself, but this month didn't really have many options."
These are excuses and are not your tenant's concern. Their concern is they rented a dwelling that is supposed to have hot water. You agreed to provide a dwelling that includes hot water. Period. End of story.
I can't image you'd be happy if your tenant called you up and said, "Laura, I don't have any rent this month...I'm a single mom with two kids..." I have told single moms with 3 kids that they need to pay their rent or move out. Period. End of story. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. The door swings both ways. I'm sure we could come up with several more applicable cliche's.
The point is it is your responsibility to provide the service that has been contracted and paid for regardless of the circumstances in your personal life. A judge will tell you if it ever comes to that, so let's do whatever is necessary to stay away from that kind of situation.
Long distance land lording is HARD. I don't recommend it for many of the reasons you just cited. The other option if this life isn't making you happy is to sell the house. Keeping it means choosing to keep the hassles. Is it worth the stress on your life? Only you know.
If you choose to keep it, having a list of 3 qualified service providers for every key area of a house is a must so that you can ensure speedy, professional resolution to valid complaints. 3 plumbers, 3 HVAC repair/installers, 3 electricians, 3 handymen, etc. Grab a phone book for the area and start making some calls today to establish contacts.
In summary, while this lesson may be expensive, it is also a valuable lesson. Learn what it has taught you. Either tune up the business practices, or sell and enjoy the cash from the windfall.
Best wishes, sincerely.
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by S i d [MO]) Posted on: Apr 10, 2017 5:32 AM
P.S. Be CAREFUL of making this tenant upset. He thinks you owe him, and to some degree he is correct. If he really knows what he's doing--and I'm guessing he does if he installs HVACs--he can easily loosen a supply line nut on the top of the water heater just enough to cause a minor, hard-to-detect leak or play some other little "trick" on you to cause major damage to the house when he moves out...stuff you might not discover for a couple of months and which will cost way more than $850 to repair.
I'd pay him and not worry too much about the other stuff. You can get the warranty info from a picture of the Model and Serial number. The manufacturer should honor the warranty regardless.
For future issues you can always use the old, "I talked to my insurance agent and he said having tenants making repairs is a liability issue..." blah blah... My insurance agent actually said that, so it's true and I use it all the time when they ask, "Can I (fill in the blank)?" --173.19.xx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Moshe [CA]) Posted on: Apr 10, 2017 9:22 AM
A good piece of work.
By the way, I point out that the tenant isn't required to give a better receipt, under the agreement as described. He only owes a receipt for what he is charging.
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Posted on: Apr 10, 2017 11:24 AM
All I want is proof that this is a new unit. He should have documentation for that, correct? I had plans to sell, but they are unwilling to work with a realtor to allow showings and I don't live close enough, yet to be available for them. I had a bunch of properties inherited when family passed so I am in the process of downsizing since they are spread out all over the state at this point. The reciepts just says "Whirlpool 50 gal HWH" no serial number or breakdown. --174.193.xxx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Richard [MI]) Posted on: Apr 10, 2017 1:15 PM
I've seen some people recommend Home Warranty Companies if you are a long distance landlord. The cost is about $350 a year and they cover things like this. If you had a policy, one call to the company and it would have been fixed by a licensed pro for the $50 deductible. Might be worth checking them out. --66.188.xx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by gevans [SC]) Posted on: Apr 10, 2017 1:40 PM
Selling your units? Do you have any in Sumter county?? --74.222.xxx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Posted on: Apr 10, 2017 3:42 PM
Gevans, I have a house in Columbia and 2 duplexs and a house in Berkeley. Nothing in Sumter though. --174.193.xxx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by LAURA [SC]) Posted on: Apr 11, 2017 4:16 PM
After reviewing the SC Law, I may be reaching at straws, but... it states that the tenant should provide, in writing, the issue at hand and I have 14 days to respond.
Note: I never received a written note, just a text when rent was due/late. After that I went to the unit with a smaller HWH (unit there waa 50 gal, I had a 40 Gal) which the female tenant proceeded to scream and cuss at me that it wouldn't work and that this was b s and they refused the unit I brought.
The female left, the male said he was able to "mend it until I was able to get a unit the same size". Looking back, It is my home and i can put whatever size in there I want, but I was so shaken by the actions and hostility I wanted to avoid the crazy wife.
So, fast forward to now and this b s receipt and it's now the 11th and the remainder (if I accept the reciept) of $250 has still not been paid. I have sent a cure or quit once in the lease term and wonder if i should just refuse any payments at this time and move forward with eviction? --174.193.xxx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by TA [CA]) Posted on: Apr 13, 2017 12:43 PM
A text is written notification. It doesn't matter if the tenant notified you in writing of their hot water not working or not, you agreed to let them replace it and deduct from rent. $850 is high but not unreasonable for a 40gal water heater and install. The time to address what is being installed, who is doing it, and how much they are charging is before it is installed. If you try to evict the tenant for unpaid rent they will bring the text messages and the receipt as proof you allowed them to do the repair and deduct, and for how much it cost. --142.254.xx.xx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Laura [SC]) Posted on: Apr 13, 2017 1:50 PM
Right.. I understand that. My issue is that rent is $1000 and I didn't even receive the receipts until aftef the 5th. It's just blatantly ignoring me for the remainder since it's the 13th and I have gotten no response. --174.255.xxx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by Ray-N-Pa [PA]) Posted on: Apr 13, 2017 7:15 PM
have them give you the serial number on the new HWT.
Depending on the make and model, the first 4 numbers should be something like 1651 which is short for 2016 the year in was built followed by the week of the year it was built --24.239.xx.xxx
Help! Tenant Reciepts (by RR78 [VA]) Posted on: Apr 14, 2017 6:38 AM
I would proceed with eviction at least for now. If I had one that would scream and cuss at me, then this would be enough for me to want to get rid of them. Have to be able to communicate.
And you stated "he said he would mend it". As far as you know that is all that he did.
Also if this was a electric water heater. There is really not a way to mend a leaking tank. If it was a problem for any other reason the parts are cheap and it could have just been fixed. --50.134.xxx.xxx
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