rent held hostage
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rent held hostage (by don [MO]) Dec 4, 2016 10:50 PM
       rent held hostage (by CDM [CA]) Dec 4, 2016 11:19 PM
       rent held hostage (by WMH [NC]) Dec 5, 2016 12:26 AM
       rent held hostage (by Pattyk [MO]) Dec 5, 2016 4:39 AM
       rent held hostage (by myob [GA]) Dec 5, 2016 5:04 AM
       rent held hostage (by Ken [NY]) Dec 5, 2016 5:14 AM
       rent held hostage (by RB [MI]) Dec 5, 2016 5:46 AM
       rent held hostage (by Gail K [GA]) Dec 5, 2016 6:39 AM
       rent held hostage (by LoriC [CO]) Dec 5, 2016 6:47 AM
       rent held hostage (by WMH [NC]) Dec 5, 2016 6:51 AM
       rent held hostage (by Barb [MO]) Dec 5, 2016 8:12 AM
       rent held hostage (by S i d [MO]) Dec 5, 2016 8:21 AM
       rent held hostage (by Moshe [CA]) Dec 5, 2016 9:44 AM
       rent held hostage (by RichE [IL]) Dec 5, 2016 9:56 AM
       rent held hostage (by melinda [MD]) Dec 5, 2016 10:56 AM
       rent held hostage (by Moshe [CA]) Dec 5, 2016 11:11 AM
       rent held hostage (by S i d [MO]) Dec 5, 2016 11:47 AM
       rent held hostage (by WMH [NC]) Dec 5, 2016 12:22 PM
       rent held hostage (by Amy [MO]) Dec 5, 2016 1:23 PM
       rent held hostage (by John... [MI]) Dec 5, 2016 2:03 PM
       rent held hostage (by myob [GA]) Dec 6, 2016 4:55 AM
       rent held hostage (by Vee [OH]) Dec 6, 2016 5:42 AM
       rent held hostage (by Robert J [CA]) Dec 6, 2016 11:50 AM
       rent held hostage (by don [MO]) Dec 9, 2016 1:31 PM
       rent held hostage (by priscilla [VT]) Dec 9, 2016 2:41 PM
       rent held hostage (by John... [MI]) Dec 9, 2016 2:48 PM
       rent held hostage (by Barb [MO]) Dec 9, 2016 3:50 PM
       rent held hostage (by mike [CA]) Dec 9, 2016 7:18 PM
       rent held hostage (by BRAD 20,000 [IN]) Dec 9, 2016 7:28 PM
       rent held hostage (by Moshe [CA]) Dec 10, 2016 10:45 AM


rent held hostage (by don [MO]) Posted on: Dec 4, 2016 10:50 PM
Message:

Called my renter(of about 9 months) about being a day late in rent payment. He said the kitchen sink was stopped up and there are fleas in the house and on his dogs. First I've heard of either. I told him I'd take care of the plumbing once the rent is paid. He would not commit to paying the rent. What would you do next? --162.229.xx.xxx




rent held hostage (by CDM [CA]) Posted on: Dec 4, 2016 11:19 PM
Message:

Unstop the sink, if your lease doesn't say he's responsible for it, then file for eviction if he hasn't paid. --24.130.xx.xx




rent held hostage (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 12:26 AM
Message:

The two are not related.

Why is the sink stopped up? Send a plumber, if it's tenant caused add to the biil owed but it needs to be fixed.

Dogs get fleas. If they were not in the place 9 months ago they are his problem for sure.

File for eviction for failure to pay rent when due and failure to properly maintain premises (fleas are a cleaning and maintenance issue.) --173.22.xx.xx




rent held hostage (by Pattyk [MO]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 4:39 AM
Message:

Don. Fix the plumbing. Do the right thing. Regardless of what he is doing. Take care of your property. You should not have said that. But just move forward. Get the plumbing taken care of. If he doesn't offer rent while you r there for plumbing then just follow your lease in regards to late rent. You don't have to say anything more. --66.87.xx.xx




rent held hostage (by myob [GA]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 5:04 AM
Message:

We find most requests for maintenance are tied, in the tenants mind, to rent due day.

Fleas are theirs- plumb issue-- -- not so sure until you find out what it is. Have plumber document for you with pics- don't hold off maintenance for rent payment. --74.184.xxx.xx




rent held hostage (by Ken [NY]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 5:14 AM
Message:

He doesn't have the rent to give you so this is his excuse,fix the problem and give him an eviction notice so he has no excuses at court --24.25.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by RB [MI]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 5:46 AM
Message:

Both Tenant Lifestyle Issues.

Work it out.........

If He's not happy living there, (for any reason)

Cut'em Loose. --24.180.xxx.x




rent held hostage (by Gail K [GA]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 6:39 AM
Message:

When tenants don't/won't pay rent they will often come up with excuses such as the stopped up sink thinking this justifies withholding rent until the repair issues are solved.

This also is an attempt to get the landlord off the real subject (paying rent) and onto something else (repairs, whether real or not).

Go over today to take a look at the stopped up sink. While you are there hand the tenant his 3 day (or whatever the number of days your state requires) Pay or Quit notice. It's helpful he gave you the ability to provide this to him in person.

Gail --73.20.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by LoriC [CO]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 6:47 AM
Message:

What Gail said--perfect opportunity to hand him his POQ notice when you are there fixing the plumbing issue, and letting him know that he will also be getting billed for the treatment of the flea infestation.

LL who practice this type of "retaliation" tactics are why so many LL's get a bad rap. Don't be that LL. --65.114.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 6:51 AM
Message:

No, don't do anything confrontational! Fix the plumbing. Issue a POQ notice. Two different things. --74.110.xxx.xx




rent held hostage (by Barb [MO]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 8:12 AM
Message:

Call the plumber. Meet plumber at residence. Have Pay Or Quit notice with you.

Also print our a notice of violation notice.

Wait while plumber takes care of stopped up sink. Once he does, evaluate whether tenant caused or something else. (For example, I had one stopped up because the disposer was locked up - because it was rusted inside after not being used in 2 years by tenant. I didn't charge tenant for that one.)

Once the plumbing is unstopped, issue pay or quit notice and if appropriate, bill for plumber's work. Plumber's work due in 10 days. You pay plumber, tenant reimburses you.

Also issue notice of violation for the fleas with a cure or quit.

Do it all while plumber is there, so that you have a witness. (Let plumber know you need a witness, and that if you end up needing to go to court, you are happy to pay plumber for his time.)

Once all notices are issued, and state required days run out, if tenant didn't pay rent, start eviction proceedings. --131.151.xx.xx




rent held hostage (by S i d [MO]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 8:21 AM
Message:

Howdy from a fellow Missouri land lord!

First, POQ is NOT required in Missouri, so don't mess with it. If rent is due on the 1st, you can file on the 2nd if it isn't paid.

I usually wait until the 8th, as a matter of practicality. Most Pro LL's in my town file on the 5th. I find a few extra drops of patience work, plus I'm guaranteed (almost always) to get my court date on or after the 1st of the NEXT month, so by waiting 3 extra days I get awarded a judgment for TWO months rent instead of 1. Yes, as crazy as that sounds if my court date is on Dec 30th I only get 1 month's rent even if everyone knows they won't be moved out until after Jan 1st. BUT, if my court date is on Jan 2nd, Iget all of Dec PLUS Jan. That's how my court works. YMMV.

There are very specific laws governing how tenants in Missouri are permitted to withhold rent. Google "RSMO Section 441.234.1" for full details.

In summary: they must notify you IN WRITING of the issue and allow 14 days (per the statute). You may contest the validity of the repair, and then the tenant must contact the city to document the issue and send the land lord a notice to repair. If the local municipal authority certifies that the repair is necessary to meet minimum standards of habitability, they issue you a certification and you then have 14 MORE DAYS from the date of that notice to fix. If you fail to fix, THEN and ONLY THEN the tenant can hire the repair done and pay for it out of the rent they owe you, up to a MAX of $300 withheld or half a month's rent, whichever is more. That's it.

So bottom line: you have 28 days from the first date of written notice from the tenant to make this right, and they can't hold back more than $300/half month's rent total, and must provide you with all receipts for the repair.

From what you've said, your tenant has done NONE of those things properly and is in violation of the lease and the laws of Missouri governing land lord/tenant relationships.

I would send my handyman over to fix the sink to avoid overflow and damage to the property as well as to make you look like a hero in front of the judge by going above and beyond what the law requires. I'd also immediately file eviction on this tenant. He is a troublemaker. There is no reason to try to salvage a relationship with someone who does these kinds of shenanigans.

Fleas (and all bugs) are tenant's responsibility unless you agreed in your lease to treat for them. His dog brought them in, most likely.

Best wishes!

--173.19.xx.xxx




rent held hostage (by Moshe [CA]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 9:44 AM
Message:

" The two are not related. "

What nonsense!

N.C.G.S. 42-41, states that "The tenant's obligation to pay rent under the rental agreement or assignment and to comply with G.S. 4243 and the landlord's obligation to comply with N.C.G.S. 4242(a) shall be mutually dependent. "

--47.139.xx.xxx




rent held hostage (by RichE [IL]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 9:56 AM
Message:

So Moshe does the North Carolina statute you quote apply to the Missouri rental situation? --98.213.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by melinda [MD]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 10:56 AM
Message:

I am going through the same thing. "Fix--- and then I am paying the rent". Not here. Hello courthouse. --24.233.xxx.xx




rent held hostage (by Moshe [CA]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 11:11 AM
Message:

RichE,

It applies to the comment (from NC) that "The two are not related".

--47.139.xx.xxx




rent held hostage (by S i d [MO]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 11:47 AM
Message:

Btw, I wanted to add that my personal standard is to have all EMERGENCY repairs (no heat in winter, no water, sewer backed up) resolved in 48 hours or less. I would call clogged sink a borderline emergency and have someone there as soon as I could find someone. Again, water damage can be horrible, and the last thing you want is tenants washing their dishes in the bathtub.

Non-emergency repairs I try to have done within a week or less. But if it's something really minor (i.e. a loose doorknob on a closet, a broken light fixture cover, etc) I accumulate all of those up in one bundle and assign them all to my handyman once per month. Saves me extra trip charges when he makes one big circle around town to diagnose all issues, go to the parts store one time, then make the circle one more time to do the fixes. --173.19.xx.xxx




rent held hostage (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 12:22 PM
Message:

Moshe, if the sink is stopped up we are going to get it fixed even if the tenant is a PITA. Not for his sake but for the property's. I don't want overflowing water anywhere.

As for fleas, that's on him as long as he lives there. --74.110.xxx.xx




rent held hostage (by Amy [MO]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 1:23 PM
Message:

He just doesn't have the rent and is using it as an excuse. Still, fix the sink so the issue doesn't get worse.

Ignore fleas or tell him you have a great flea treatment that costs $50 per treatment paid upfront. He's welcome to use a cheaper one if he can find it. --107.77.xx.xxx




rent held hostage (by John... [MI]) Posted on: Dec 5, 2016 2:03 PM
Message:

Moshe: Where has the landlord in this situation not complied with something like N.C.G.S. 4242(a) exactly?

4242(a) has a list of things that the LL shall do. From what I can tell in this situation, even if NC law applied, he has DONE all of those things. (The one that discusses fixing plumbing issues promptly explicitly states that the LL must be informed of this problem IN WRITING -- which HAS NOT been done in this situation.)

So, at this point in time and with the information given, even in NC, I would say that WMH's comment that "the two are not related" is accurate.

Right now, the non-working kitchen sink and the failure to pay rent ARE NOT RELATED. Because no violation of something like 4242(a) -- if it were the applicable state -- has occurred.

- John...

--207.241.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by myob [GA]) Posted on: Dec 6, 2016 4:55 AM
Message:

MOSHA CA-- are you kidding us? That law makes so much sense and is in line with most posters STATES here on Mr. LL. Why is it then that CA gets it so screwed up? I mean every time there's a sad LL story (as in against a LL)it eliminates from CA posts? --74.184.xxx.xx




rent held hostage (by Vee [OH]) Posted on: Dec 6, 2016 5:42 AM
Message:

The drains were free flowing when you took tenancy at the residence, simple statement -if I pull it out and you did not eat it you pay the bill-, pets and fleas go together like peas and carrots - tenant is responsible for flea treatment now and then at moveout, I can hear my niece yelling at one of her first tenants who took in a rescue dog -it does not matter if the dog was here for 15 minutes, 15 days or months, the pest control guy cost to eradicate fleas is the same and it will be added to your next rent cycle. --76.188.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by Robert J [CA]) Posted on: Dec 6, 2016 11:50 AM
Message:

Yesterday around 7 AM I received a call from a tenant renting a 4+3 single family home. His washing machine drain line was clogged and the kitchen disposal was leaking. He said that he hadn't sent the rent check because I hadn't taken care of these issues.

At the property I asked him how I was notified. He responded that his adult children had contacted me. They were home still in bed, 22 and 26 with no jobs. So I had their mother wake them up. I asked them to provide me with my cell phone, home phone or email address, they couldn't. Then I asked their father, how could they have given me notice if they don't have my contact information?

I asked and received the rent check, then snaked the drain line and replaced the garbage disposal.

I don't like it when "rent" is held hostage, but what get's me more upset is a lie being used... --47.151.xx.xxx




rent held hostage (by don [MO]) Posted on: Dec 9, 2016 1:31 PM
Message:

I unclogged the drain(expecting him to pay the rent) and asked for my rent money. Tenant said he had other bills to pay. Ha ha. I handed him his Quit or Pay --162.229.xx.xxx




rent held hostage (by priscilla [VT]) Posted on: Dec 9, 2016 2:41 PM
Message:

My attorney suggested that if your going to file an eviction, don't file it for non-payment, in our state the judges like to prolong the eviction so the tenant can catch up, that rarely happens and your out another month or 2 of rent, just fyi --64.222.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by John... [MI]) Posted on: Dec 9, 2016 2:48 PM
Message:

What does he suggest you file for?

That is basically the OPPOSITE of what most Landlords here recommend and have experienced. In general, most of us say that it is almost ALWAYS better to file eviction for non-payment than for any other lease violation. Simply because there is no real argument for non-payment. They either have paid or they haven't and it is easy to prove. (Unlike lease violations where they are sometimes open to "interpretation.")

So -- unless Vermont is very, very different from most states -- that seems like pretty poor advice to me from your attorney, sorry.

- John...

--207.241.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by Barb [MO]) Posted on: Dec 9, 2016 3:50 PM
Message:

Don - Sadly, none of us are surprised.

Hopefully, you only gave him until Monday to pay or quit, and gave it in front of the plumber, and the plumber can be called to testify if needed.

Please make sure you follow up with eviction ASAP.

For your next tenant, look Clearnow rent collection. I LOVE IT!!!! I've got one that was always a slow payer that since I started using Clearnow is always on time. --131.151.xx.xx




rent held hostage (by mike [CA]) Posted on: Dec 9, 2016 7:18 PM
Message:

get busy on the plumbing...water can ruin stuff fast. this is NOT a California thing unless the tenant can prove a LONG history of neglected repairs and maintenance by the landy.

we do have provisions for withholding rent in exceptional cases but it's not a thing that happens regularly. while there take him aside and explain that the rent is due and that you need the check now. if he says no, deliver the notice to pay and tell him you resent his making you do this as it makes you seem like the a - hole and you don't appreciate it.

as always the way to get deadbeats out is to not grant leases...there is no defense to a notice to terminate tenancy unless it can be shown to be retaliatory,and i have NEVER heard of case where a rent raise was contested as retaliatory. --76.176.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by BRAD 20,000 [IN]) Posted on: Dec 9, 2016 7:28 PM
Message:

Don,

Quick answer: when learn of the need for a repair, FIX IT quickly!

Demanding the rent before making a repair "is fightin' words" to a renter and my judge would throw the book at you.

The law says the LL maintains the property, so maintain and BE BLAMELESS. We time stamp when requests com ein, the time we called them to set an appt, and the time it was completed.

Stats say the number one reason residents do not renew is lack of response to repairs.

My "stats" are that silly little repairs become big headaches and will ALWAYS come up in court if the lease goes to eviction.

IMPT: in this age of Yelp, Facebook, and RateYourLandlord.com, our online reputation is just as important as any restaurant or car dealership. One click from a frustrated res is bad news even if they are wrong. (been there)

That said, unless your res reported these problems earlier I suggest they are looking to distract you, turn the blame on you, for an excuse to justify their lack of money.

With a good lease, A clogged drain (unless it's the main sewer line) and fleas are the res' problem UNLESS you can prove they were not a problem at move in (again, a good lease).

Autodraft: why oh why, in this new millennium, the computer age of money passing digitally from them to my account, do LLs sit and wait, HOPING their res will CHOOSE to not get a tatoo., not fix their car, or not buy more beer but pay their rent instead??

Helpful Hint: Put a ZIP IT tool in each home ($2.99). Clears clogs easily. Another excuse elminiated!

Glad to hear it worked out!

Stay strong and stay on top of this!

BRAD --73.146.xxx.xxx




rent held hostage (by Moshe [CA]) Posted on: Dec 10, 2016 10:45 AM
Message:

Mike[CA]:

" i have NEVER heard of case where a rent raise was contested as retaliatory"

I have. It is explicitly stated in the code.

" If the lessor retaliates against the lessee ... the lessor may not recover possession of a dwelling in any action or proceeding, cause the lessee to quit involuntarily, INCREASE THE RENT, or decrease any services within 180 days of ...

--47.139.xx.xxx





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