Last week I got a call from a low-income tenant and she claims her house is now infested with rats. On Saturday, I went to investigate her claim and the first thing I noticed was an excessive amount of junk in every room of her small 3/1 house. I did not see any rats or mice, however, she is convinced the house is infested with them.

I told her that if you have any rodents in this house, the only way to deal with them is to first remove this junk (she calls it home furnishings) out of the way so that rodent entry holes can be located and plugged.

I even gave her the Happy Clause and told her she is free to move out if this 'rodent situation' is too much for her to live with.

I had one that I didn't discover soon enough. She moved on her own accord because I'm convinced she couldn't take it anymore. The place was destroyed by animal waste and was roach and flea infested. She never called me for anything because I'm sure she was too embarrassed.. It was a sad situation and we had to gut the place.

Lisa,

My tenant loves living here and when I suggested she move this junk out, that statement irritated her. She is freaked out about these mystery rodents though,...she claims they live inside the walls and only come out at night. I had a new bag of green rat bait blocks (Tomcat brand) with me and she said her rats eat those green blocks like they were candy,...in other words, she has already tried these and they don't work on her rats.

Lisa,

My lease too states that pest control is the tenant responsibility.

That being said, I always make an attempt to solve my tenants pest control issues. It lets them know I am not ignoring them and I am making an effort to solve their problem. I tell the tenants that if I can't solve your pest problem, you will have to call a professional at your expense.

I have one hoarder. Luckily she is in a VERY small place (one room studio) and can't do too much harm. She does tend to collect stuff UNDER her elevated place but every now and again we issues a "Clean Up!" order and she does her best.

If she were in a larger home at all we would not be renting to her still, but she's been here 7 years or so and it's rather contained so we are good.

Hoarding is usually connected to mental illness. And the objects they surround themselves with are usually emotional crutches of some sort, that help them deal with or avoid the bigger problem in their life. It's sort of like if I have an emotional attachment to certain childhood toys... it's not "just" a Happy Apple or a Raggedy Ann, but when I look at it, it reminds me of how life was at a certain point in time, or of my family as it once existed, or of a certain series of events, or of my past self as I once existed. So throwing away that toy is the equivalent of losing those memories. It's a simplified explanation, but it's roughly why hoarders have difficulty throwing out their junk, even if it's just trash bags full of garbage... it's like telling someone to forget their childhood memories.

What exactly is the question then? How to deal with this or how worse can it get? I bought a place recently with a hoarder tenant which I required was removed before I closed.

I thought my first hoarding situation was bad but this one was far worse. I have pictures but without the stench that's still with me every time I look at them you can't get the full effect.

The situation will only get worse in my experience. Your place will be destroyed, infested and become a fire hazard. You'll need to gut it in the end.

I've found that it's not unusual that the low-income tenants tend to "save" everything.

I'm not sure if it's because they've had so little in their lives previously that everything they come across is precious to them or they save things we'd consider junk with the hope of fixing it up sometime in the future and either using it themselves or selling it for money.

Has anyone (CAN we do this legally) put a clause in a lease to limit the amount of stuff tenants can drag into a house...other than the usual concerns about flammable, dangerous, etc. items?

When one low income family moved out they left behind a broken dryer (stored on the back porch) they had moved in with four years earlier, a non-working window air conditioner and a rusty, unplugged chest high freezer half filled with rotted meat (gag)..along with the obligatory broken furniture, old clothes, bedding, mismatched shoes, christmas decorations, burnt pots and pans,, etc. etc. etc.. Except for the sheets and comforters which could be washed and then donated none of this stuff was usable (or even touchable without gloves).

I guess we were lucky that they did haul away the broken down van Mr. Calvin ("Mr Fix It") had been attempting to get up a running for the past couple of years.

I should point out it's not only low-income folks that can be hoarders; both my own brother and sister have hoarder tendencies. My sister has saved probably every receipt from every store she has shopped at for the past several decades (for what purpose even she can't explain).

My brother is even worse; he likes to go to estate sales and buy things cheap with the idea of reselling them at a huge profit...except he never gets around to selling them; just boxes them up carefully and stores them. His basement is one of those places where you can only get to the washer and dryer by following a narrow path. No one can eat at the dining room table because there's a second dining room table stored on top of the first one. When my sister and I flew into his town for our dads memorial service we had to stay at a motel because there LITERALLY was no room at his place to even lie down on any floor to sleep.

As a result of all of this whenever I go into a rental property where a tenant has crammed enough stuff into a three bedroom house to fit into a six bedroom place all I can think of is 1. How can you live like this? and 2. Good heavens; I hope I don't have to go through an eviction with you and have to haul all this stuff out to the curb.

OK...off my soapbox now.

Hoarders tend not to clean well, which often attracts pest and gives them nice little warm places to hide. It also covers up damages which can get worse as time goes on.

My worst experience was with outdoor hoarders. 2 bed house....they had 4 vehicles, a trampoline, kids' playground, two utility trailers, a junky old "John" boat, 2-3 non-working grills...etc. Inside they were slobs. Place got overrun by roaches, which crawled into the circuit board of the HVAC and fried it. After they finally moved out we had to scrub all walls, light/wall socket covers removed, vacuumed out and scrubbed. Total repaint of the unit. Stank of roach poo for 2 weeks. We ran an ozone machine for several days to clean it all out.

This is the beginning of a long rabbit hole. Nip it in the bud now before it becomes a complete remodel.

Roy, I assume that you didn't find any other "proof" of rodents - they typically will leave something behind :)

What you are using (TomCat) DOES work on Rats - unfortunately I know that it does since I have a house that the street in front of it was having sewer repairs being performed along with the fact that the houses next door were being "cleaned out" and my tenant said "uh ... I think we have an issue - I think there are squirrels or something - we can hear them".

I didn't let on but I went into the basement and loaded it up with that stuff. After a few days - NOTHING (meaning the tenant said everything stopped). I went down into the basement and a few of them were there (laying on the floor).

If your tenant has used that stuff and thinks it isn't working then either you don't have rats OR she has MANY and you need to load it up.

However - as for the hoarding - that's going to be a tough one. Is it really "hoarding" or does she just have a lot of stuff that (for you) is "more than enough"? I have seen hoarding when looking at apartments (to purchase) and there are just little pathways with PILES of clothes or whatever they are "collecting" and can't get rid of (in their opinion).

Tomcat works. She's probably just worried about finding the rats once they crawl off and die.

Have you ever tried to clean a water leak, etc with hoarders? Near impossible. Maybe figure out what your "crap cap" is on that and tell her it's a code and fire hazard.

While I was there on Saturday, I tried to open one of the spare bedroom doors and it would only open half way until it hit furniture that had been crammed inside. She refused to let me open her 3rd bedroom door saying that is was rat infested.

From the front door to the back door (25 feet) is a narrow path you walk through. I had to use a flash light since she does not replace light bulbs and seems to prefer the darkness.

Near the back door is a small laundry room. Behind the W/D is where she claims the rats are coming in. I told her if she would move the W/D away from the wall, I would plug the rat holes with quick-set drywall mud. Problem here is there is no room in front of the W/D (more junk) to move the W/D away from the wall.

This tenant has been with me for a little over a year. She has a 40 hour a week job. She is not home bound by any means.

Since she pays rent, I can't evict her. I can issue a 30 day notice to end her MTM lease but something is keeping me from doing that. I do not want her to think I am evicting her just because she reported a rodent problem.

Whenever I entertain the idea of asking a 'rent paying tenant' to vacate (it is rare), the very first thing I do is look at my calendar. I have an old fashioned desktop paper calendar and everything that may happen in my near future gets written down on this calendar.

Looking at the calendar, I start counting the number of days it will take get this tenant out. The law requires a 30 day notice to terminate her MTL lease. Since she will not move out in 30 days, I will have to file for eviction in late October. Assuming no court date, the earliest the constable would show up would be around Thanksgiving. I know from past experience (10 years) that the worst time (here) to have a vacancy is between Thanksgiving and mid-January.

Roy--only you know a) your market for winter renting; and b) what your tolerance level is for the hoarding and "rat infestation" and most likely, damage, issue.

If you wait, it will also be another 4-5 months (if you think you will have to evict in the end) of adding to her hoarding, damage from not cleaning, and unobserved water leaks, etc and more rodents and possible insect activity. Hoarders can cause extreme amounts of damage, JMHO.

Can you convince her to start to hoard cats? She will have to allow you to help her. If she doesn't, her fate is sealed....

LoriC,

Some of my Class C houses are located down in the 'hood' and my hoarder tenant is living on one of them. Since these houses tend to attract Class C or D tenants, I have done things (during past vacancies) to reinforce the houses in an attempt to make them 'bullet-proof'. Heavy duty metal doors on the front and back are one item that comes to mind. The hardwood floors got painted with oil based floor paint which keeps pet urine from soaking in. The kitchen, bath, laundry room floors all have VCT tiles which is more durable than anything else. The heating and air units are very basic and disposable.

Ray (PA)

Ugh, hoarders. I agree it's a sticky situation if she is paying rent.

Me, I'd want to have full access and get whatever the problem is cleaned up. But if she refuses access and/or refuses to get rid of the junk, you are in a pickle.

Roy,

I had a hoarder once and it was just like on TV. She was with us 7 years and the hoarding started about year 4. When we discovered it, we already knew the place would be a complete teardown so we rode it as long as we could. She never missed a rent payment.

She moved the month after my hubby died. She was one of 6 trashed units I dealt with that month. That was also the month I received Certified mail from the IRS letting me know I was facing an audit for 2009 and 2010. It was by far the worst year of my life...so far.

My crew had to wear masks due to cat urine and feces and rotting food fumes. I had 2 20 foot dumpsters placed in the yard for the trash. We found nice hardwood floors under carpeting which we treated with Clorox for smell and sealed. All walls taken down to studs. Toilet clogged and black, she was using kitchen sink. After 90 days, I was able to sell a lot of her stuff on eBay for a good price.

Gail, I added this clause in my lease at the request of the Fire Department:

Lana (IN)

This is a small 700 square ft. house and it has been trashed on several occasions in the last 8 years. The good news is, due to it small size, it only takes about 4 hours to get in and clean it up. Once the junky furniture (oh excuse me,...Antiques!) hits the curb, the local scavengers remove it within one hour. Using a garden leaf rake, you go in and rake up all of the debris on the floors and make one big pile in the living room. If the house reeks of some odor, well, you hose it down with lemon scented Clorox.

I had a married couple with four children living in my five bedroom house for three years. I inspected the house every six months. It found it little cluttered and not as clean as would like it, but there was not much damages. For about four months I noted that the yard and porch were becoming unsightly. One day the tenant informed me that the sewage was clogged. My sewage service man of ten years and I went into the basement and discovered that the basement stunk from an inch high sewage and the basement was full of large trash bags that were stacked from one wall to the next so tight that we could not make a path through them. The sewage man walked out of the house and told me, “That’s the worse mess I ever saw and I’m not going to do anything in there.” The woman told me that the clothes washer broke down and they haven’t had enough money to go to a laundromat. The kitchen sink was full of dirty dishes sitting in stagnate water and the faucet was broken in half. One bathroom had a broken toilet seat and the floor tile was ripped up. One of their teenagers drew pictures and phrases all over two of her bedroom walls. ...

Roy,

Let's call this reason #23 for doing In-Home Visits before final approval!

We've had several hoarders. Recently bought a foreclosure and removed 9 TONS of stuff plus a trailer of metal and trailer to recycling. Last month filled a 40 yard roll off with leftovers from an eviction for a tiny house. They were not hoarders, just left stuff.

I see 2 kinds: collector/pilers and stinkers.

I don't mind dry piles, clutter, and stacks. It's their problem so I let it ride.

But stinkers have cats and smoking and rotting food. THOSE need to go NOW! They can ruin the house with odo from bugs and critters behind the walls.

In the past I've said "It's already bad, I'll have to clean it up anyway, can't get any worse" but it does.

Unless the place stinks it sounds like some rat control will solve your dilemma.

DCon is no longer working for us. Tomcat green blocks did not do the trick. Check online for other poisons. My pest guy uses 3 different types on each treatment.

Here are some home made baits www.wikihow.com/Make-Rat-Poison

Plaster powder and cornmeal with milk, rolled into a ball, and others. The plaster gives them ultimate constipation.

Also, if hoarding is a mental illness, the rats might not be real. In that case tell her the rats have taken over the house and will come after her next - get your house back without eviction!

BRAD

Brad20K,

I have been waiting on you to reply to this post. What took you so long?

"Let's call this reason #23 for doing In-Home Visits before final approval!"

Okay, Okay,...I am convinced now that in-home visits prior to approval are absolutely necessary. I am a person who learns from trial and error and I can now see the error in my ways. (At the time, she was the only applicant that had a real job and full move-in money).

From what I can tell, this lady has 'dry piles of junk' according to your description. Thank God she does not have 20 cats in the house or any cats or dogs. Plus, she moved in with her own kitchen appliances which includes stand alone freezer.

I will check online for the home-made rat baits. Does the plaster bait actually kill the rats or just make them sick with constipation? I am trying not to laugh here.

Arnold (OH)

Your reply reminds me of why I will NEVER buy a rental house that has a basement. You could not give me a house that has a basement. Every basement house I have looked at has got a sump-pump and way too space for tenants to store junk in.

Roy, That article has another recipe with flour, sugar, and baking soda.

"The bicarbonate of the baking soda reacts with the rat's stomach acids to produce a carbon dioxide gas. Rats are unable to pass gas. The gas will build up in the rat's system and eventually cause internal blockage or rupture." Bummer.

But nice to know that rats cannot pass gas! See what we learn here!

BRAD

Brad20K,

No animal, including rats, should have to die a slow death from bicarbonate of soda building up in their system and creating flatulence.

I also have a hoarder, so I was researching evicting a hoarder and came to find out they are "protected" and we need provide them with reasonable accommodations.

It’s against the law to discriminate against disabled individuals, and hoarding is a recognized and diagnosable mental disorder in the DSM-5, the book used by the American Psychiatric Association (APA) to classify mental disorders. Because hoarding is considered a disability, property owners must comply with the Fair Housing Act and provide reasonable accommodations.

Soooo...I told my tenant they were violating fire codes because the egresses were blocked, and I gave them 10 days to fix it, or move. They are in the process of moving by the 1st. I just want all of their stuff gone.

Julie, curious if your hoarders told you that they had a diagnosis...I was under the impression that they had to have a diagnosis, because hoarding is one of those things that is subjective. I thought many hoarders had problems being diagnosed as being a hoarder without outside intervention. They don't always see themselves as hoarders. Would they admit to being a hoarder and admit they have a diagnosis?

They haven't said a word about it actually. I just can imagine it being brought up in eviction court, some savvy lawyer stuff you know. I can just imagine them playing whatever card they need to so they don't have to move and at the same time stir up some trouble for me. I did 2 inspections and they still had doors and windows not accessible and clothing piled up against the furnace. At some point they said they were going to get one of those PODs things and put their "extra" stuff in there. 2 weeks later, nothing changed. They were just weaving stories to dealy delay delay. Finally I told them if I didn't see the PODs thing in the driveway by that Friday, their lease wouldn't be renewed for the 1st of the month. We are 2 days away from the 1st of October, I am keeping my fingers crossed they are gone.