Gun ownership (by Natasha [MD]) Jun 15, 2016 6:29 AM
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Jun 15, 2016 6:32 AM
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Jun 15, 2016 6:32 AM
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Jun 15, 2016 6:48 AM
Gun ownership (by plenty [MO]) Jun 15, 2016 6:53 AM
Gun ownership (by Bit [IN]) Jun 15, 2016 7:42 AM
Gun ownership (by AllyM [NJ]) Jun 15, 2016 7:56 AM
Gun ownership (by LoriC [CO]) Jun 15, 2016 8:02 AM
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Jun 15, 2016 9:01 AM
Gun ownership (by Vee [OH]) Jun 15, 2016 9:23 AM
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Jun 15, 2016 9:32 AM
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Jun 15, 2016 9:38 AM
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Jun 15, 2016 9:51 AM
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Jun 15, 2016 9:54 AM
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Jun 15, 2016 9:55 AM
Gun ownership (by John... [MI]) Jun 15, 2016 9:55 AM
Gun ownership (by Ken [NY]) Jun 15, 2016 10:11 AM
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Jun 15, 2016 10:49 AM
Gun ownership (by Landlord ofthe Flies [TX]) Jun 15, 2016 11:27 AM
Gun ownership (by cjo'h [CT]) Jun 15, 2016 11:36 AM
Gun ownership (by cjo'h [CT]) Jun 15, 2016 11:46 AM
Gun ownership (by LoriC [CO]) Jun 15, 2016 11:51 AM
Gun ownership (by Chris [CT]) Jun 15, 2016 12:14 PM
Gun ownership (by LindaJ [NY]) Jun 15, 2016 12:38 PM
Gun ownership (by RB [MI]) Jun 15, 2016 1:25 PM
Gun ownership (by mike [CA]) Jun 15, 2016 1:33 PM
Gun ownership (by J [FL]) Jun 15, 2016 2:12 PM
Gun ownership (by Jay [CA]) Jun 15, 2016 4:00 PM
Gun ownership (by Jeffrey [VA]) Jun 15, 2016 4:27 PM
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Jun 15, 2016 4:41 PM
Gun ownership (by Jay [CA]) Jun 15, 2016 4:48 PM
Gun ownership (by Ray-N-Pa [PA]) Jun 15, 2016 5:08 PM
Gun ownership (by Barb [MO]) Jun 15, 2016 5:23 PM
Gun ownership (by Rocking Bear [FL]) Jun 15, 2016 9:57 PM
Gun ownership (by nhsailmaker [NH]) Jun 16, 2016 3:37 AM
Gun ownership (by gevans [SC]) Jun 16, 2016 9:37 AM
Gun ownership (by Don [PA]) Jun 16, 2016 2:52 PM
Gun ownership (by LivetheDream [AZ]) Jun 16, 2016 7:39 PM
Gun ownership (by LivetheDream [AZ]) Jun 16, 2016 7:44 PM
Gun ownership (by Mickie [OH]) Jun 17, 2016 4:31 AM
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Jun 17, 2016 5:05 AM
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Jun 17, 2016 5:06 AM
Gun ownership (by Gary [OK]) Jun 17, 2016 5:22 AM
Gun ownership (by Steve [WA]) Jun 17, 2016 11:16 AM
Gun ownership (by Steve [WA]) Jun 17, 2016 11:16 AM
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Jun 17, 2016 12:31 PM
Gun ownership (by John... [MI]) Jun 17, 2016 5:45 PM
Gun ownership (by gevans [SC]) Jun 19, 2016 4:48 AM
Gun ownership (by John... [MI]) Jun 20, 2016 6:33 AM
Gun ownership (by gevans [SC]) Jun 20, 2016 8:22 AM
Gun ownership (by Don [PA]) Jun 20, 2016 9:36 AM
Gun ownership (by Mickie [OH]) Jun 20, 2016 11:27 AM
Gun ownership (by Natasha [MD]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 6:29 AM Message:
Curious to know what clause if any do most landlords put in their lease about gun ownership. We have a rural property which is a new market for us where hunting and guns are the normal. If you allow gun owners, what do you request and do you word the lease differently or do you just don't allow any gun owners even in the country.
--162.72.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 6:32 AM Message:
my clause is that they have to follow all local state and federal laws.
don't ask don't tell! --12.173.xxx.xx |
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 6:32 AM Message:
The Constitution allows gun ownership. --70.209.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 6:48 AM Message:
Careful NE, the constitution also allows for private property rights and freedom of contract --12.173.xxx.xx |
Gun ownership (by plenty [MO]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 6:53 AM Message:
aren't their already law and rules about owning guns??? what are you concerns? is there an issue with your insurance? --173.108.xxx.xx |
Gun ownership (by Bit [IN]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 7:42 AM Message:
Why would you be concerned about someone owning a gun in a rural house? I would just follow state laws. --74.130.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by AllyM [NJ]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 7:56 AM Message:
Let the authorities handle that. --73.33.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by LoriC [CO]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 8:02 AM Message:
US Citizens still have a right to bear arms. You cannot arbitrarily decide you are going to "prohibit" them from owning one and you certainly can't enforce it.
If you put a clause like that in your lease it won't be worth the paper it was written on. Not your business. You do not want to be that closely involved in your tenant's private lives or you won't be sleeping at night. --65.114.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 9:01 AM Message:
LoriC, businesses everywhere prohibit customers and employees from bringing firearms onto their property. --12.159.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Vee [OH]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 9:23 AM Message:
Here it is promoted, when seconds count the community first responders are minutes and more away. Funny thing I called the non-emergency line to report what appeared to be a light weight auto accident, the recording repeats itself at least 10 times -do not hang up, your call will be answered in a few moments- all this time I got off the highway and purchased 2 lemonaids from walgreens cooler and back in my car towards the workplace.... --76.188.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 9:32 AM Message:
vee, the city most my rentals are in, I called police to write a report for a minor fender bender on a residential street. They were there in 5 mins --166.137.xx.xx |
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 9:38 AM Message:
David, go to YouTube and enter: woman killed while on phone with 911.
Had she been prepared, the outcome could've been different.
I can tell you're vehemently against guns, but they have their place. Most importantly in the home.
--70.209.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 9:51 AM Message:
NE, you tell wrong! I simply support property rights.
The orlando shooting was ONE GUY yet three trained officers that arrived right away couldn't take him down. So tell me again what outcome?? --12.173.xxx.xx |
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 9:54 AM Message:
NE, do you think walmart or the local bowling alley does not have the right to ban people from bringing firearms on their property? That is the question raised, not whether you can have firearms in your own property. --12.159.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 9:55 AM Message:
I'm not pulling Orlando into this. Guns are also personal property. --70.209.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by John... [MI]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 9:55 AM Message:
I'm with David on this. While people might have a right to bear arms -- that actually does NOT override our private property rights.
If I want to say that I don't rent to people that drive blue cars, then I can do it. It's not illegal discrimination because blue car drivers are not a protected class.
Now, I don't have a problem with guns nor guns on my property -- but that doesn't mean that I can't restrict them if I WANT to. Sure, it may be hard to enforce -- but LOTS of us have no-smoking or even no-pets clauses that, technically, are also "hard to enforce" if they hide it well. It doesn't mean that the clause might not still be useful.
So, again, I'm not going to restrict it -- but I support private property rights and our right to restrict it if we so decide.
- John...
--207.241.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Ken [NY]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 10:11 AM Message:
I agree with John,I am 100% for guns and will never tell a tenant they can't have a gun in the house but if I own the house then I make the rules.As someone else here has said I won't ask a tenant if they have guns as I wouldn't want to embarrass them if the answer was no. --24.25.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 10:49 AM Message:
But why ban blue cars? I understand wanting total control of the properties in that sense and we should have it, but we really don't.
The banning of guns or blue cars comes down to more of a personal/political issue than an actual landlording/property management issue.
It's kind of the same thing I posted about the other day regarding the graduation party with tons of people there.
That freaks me out, so I ask for advice.
I asked here and actually called people locally.
I ask here and people say to let it go, it doesn't matter and it's none of my business. This issue is no different at all.
There's a ton of things I don't like on my properties and what it boils down to are my personal perspectives on how I think I should be able to run my properties, not actual issues.
I don't like visitors/parties.
I don't like clutter.
I don't like that some people sit around all day watching tv.
These are personal things that I have to get over to run a fair business. I think the gun issue is the same thing aside from political stigma.
--70.209.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Landlord ofthe Flies [TX]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 11:27 AM Message:
I doubt property rights apply in this case. Wouldn't the tenant's property rights overrule your rights to that property? By renting you assign some of your rights to them. I suspect this would be one of them. However, you can discriminate for a variety of reasons. I'm sure this would be one of them since it's not a protected class.
However, why would you? Especially if that gun owner had a license to carry and passed a background check. --99.125.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by cjo'h [CT]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 11:36 AM Message:
Natasha,I didn't know you still had areas that were rural, that's nice to know. If they want to have a gun and everything else is copaceticital,I wouldn't e even bring it up.Most Americans are too paranoid now to even suggest that. Your going to drive Miss Alley out of her ever loving mind. Thoughts from a country boy! Charlie....... ...... ..... .... . --70.215.x.xxx |
Gun ownership (by cjo'h [CT]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 11:46 AM Message:
Natasha, that 2nd Amendment that's bandied about so much was written into the Constitution by a gentleman from the next town over from where I come from in Northern Ireland
Charlie....... ...... ..... .... ... .. . ....... --70.215.x.xxx |
Gun ownership (by LoriC [CO]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 11:51 AM Message:
I'm waiting for LTD's response. . . .
and I bet you would be surprised at how many people with CC permits DO walk into business that say they don't allow it---you can't pat down the world. --65.114.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Chris [CT]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 12:14 PM Message:
My lease doesn't cover it and I don't think it should.
I can't believe in a rural area this is a concern, I live in an urban area and most people I know have firearms, heck most of my renters probably do. Its simply a none issue.
--67.82.xxx.xx |
Gun ownership (by LindaJ [NY]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 12:38 PM Message:
I rent to responsible people. This is not something I address in my rental agreement. I don't care if they have guns or not. It isn't my business. I don't care if they drink vodka or wine or not at all. Not my business. As long as they are responsible, which I do the best to find out before I rent to them.
--100.4.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by RB [MI]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 1:25 PM Message:
Gun ownership (by mike [CA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 1:33 PM Message:
rural or not, my constitution protects ones right to arms for whatever reason they choose
guns...no problem.
now, if he or she has a Hillary sticker, and it doesn't say "for prison" well, they will be denied
--75.80.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by J [FL]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 2:12 PM Message:
I don't have anything about guns...I have something called a "drug free housing/crime addendum". Besides the law on guns in this state is pretty loose...I'm not sure I'm allowed to dictate their right to own a gun. --72.188.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Jay [CA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 4:00 PM Message:
Most leases/rental contracts state that no crimes be committed on the property. I know mine does. This is good enough for me.
As long as the tenant does not break any laws, I am fine with his or her gun ownership. I never ask. --216.165.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Jeffrey [VA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 4:27 PM Message:
I do not address the subject of guns in my lease. Up to this point, for me, has not been an issue. But I thought some of you would find the following article interesting.
Judge backs Rockland landlord that threatened to evict gun-owning tenant.
Harvey Lembo's rights were not violated when he was told to get rid of the weapon he used to shoot an intruder or face expulsion from his subsidized apartment, the ruling says.
Retired Rockland lobsterman Harvey Lembo shot an intruder in his apartment but was later told by the landlord that he couldn’t keep a gun there.
A Rockland man’s civil rights were not violated when the landlord of his subsidized apartment told him to give up his gun or face eviction after he shot an intruder, a Knox County judge ruled this week.
Harvey Lembo, a 68-year-old retired and disabled lobsterman living in Rockland, shot Christopher Wildhaber after midnight Sept. 1. Lembo had bought the pistol less than 24 hours earlier after several break-ins at his apartment.
Lawyers argue for Rockland tenant’s right to own gun in subsidized housing. Lembo’s suit, filed in November 2015, claimed that his landlord’s threat to evict him through the courts violated his Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms, and violated the Maine Civil Rights Act. Lembo, who uses a wheelchair, had argued that he needed the gun to protect himself after his home was burglarized multiple times in recent years.
But Justice William Stokes found that Lembo’s claims failed to meet the basic standard that would give him grounds for the case to move forward.
“We felt the law with regard to how you apply the civil rights act was clear and that Justice Stokes decided the case appropriately,” said Jim Bowie, attorney for Stanford Management LLC, one of the two companies named as defendants. Stanford Management LLC provides subsidized housing in Maine and western Pennsylvania and has a set of house rules separate from the lease agreement that stipulates renters are not to possess guns. --173.71.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 4:41 PM Message:
Jeffrey, my father-in-laws parents live in elderly subsidized housing with the same type rules.
I think they have that in their lease right in the beginning. I'm not sure if it's accepted because it's subsidized or not.
The man is 80 years old and was telling me about it at Easter this year.
He's been around guns his whole life, hunter and target shooter. He gave most of his guns away but kept one when they moved into senior housing.
He said they'll never know and shrugged his shoulders.
I can't say I blame him. A person like that would rather be able to protect themselves and deal with getting kicked out later than not be able to defend themselves and deal with a burglar while unarmed.
Another thing to think about is this: if a landlord prohibits a gun in the unit, how will they enforce it?
You can ask, they can lie. It's not like you can search through their belongings. So enforcement is pretty much an impossibility.
What was the outcome of the case you posted about?
--50.107.xxx.xx |
Gun ownership (by Jay [CA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 4:48 PM Message:
Harvey Lembo is a perfect example of why people should be allowed to keep guns in their home for their own protection. I guess the LL would rather have a Dead tenant than guns on his property.
I hope Lembo sues his LL for failing to provide a safe property. --216.165.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Ray-N-Pa [PA]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 5:08 PM Message:
Guns are almost expected out here in Western Pa.
With maybe the exception of cars and pets, I don't place any restrictions on what the tenant can and can't have...as long as its legal.
Who am I to tell a tenant that they can't have a flower garden, pictures of the pope, left handed monkey wrenches or a sword collection. As long as my insurance doesn't take issue with what ever it is......then its not a business decision for me for the most part.
Interesting article Jeffery.......Maine is an incredibly liberal and diverse state. My in-laws live about 20 minutes from Rockland --72.23.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Barb [MO]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 5:23 PM Message:
I don't address it in mine. Many of my tenants over the years have been deer hunters. The deer in parts of my state are thick enough to be considered vermin by the farmers. Those kids start learning firearm safety at a young age.
The city kids won't introduce a gun and the country kids all took hunters safety.
The idea that a tenant who was robbed more than once and is being evicted over a firearm because the LL decided he wasn't allowed to have a gun wouldn't fly in my area. --64.251.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Rocking Bear [FL]) Posted on: Jun 15, 2016 9:57 PM Message:
I would never infringe on someone's rights to protect themselves/family, and I would not try to police it, my job is to get paid on time and provide a clean habitable place, we all know that tenants lie, anyways look at all the felons with weapons that are not suppose to have them. If I remember right LTD loves CCW holders because of the background checks they go through and responsibility to own said gun/weapon. --71.1.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by nhsailmaker [NH]) Posted on: Jun 16, 2016 3:37 AM Message:
I ask if they own guns on my application - WHY you might ask? - the Sheriff specifically asks if tenant has guns when they have to serve a tenant. Important to Know the answer to that question --96.61.xx.xx |
Gun ownership (by gevans [SC]) Posted on: Jun 16, 2016 9:37 AM Message:
Hmmm....
So you want to make your property a "gun free zone"?
How did that work out in Orlando, Sandy Hook, or the multitude of other "gun free zones" that had killings?
Only honest, law abiding citizens will honor a "gun free zone". Why would you want to restrict guns to the lawbreakers?
I'm fine with my tenants owning guns.
--216.218.xx.xx |
Gun ownership (by Don [PA]) Posted on: Jun 16, 2016 2:52 PM Message:
DavidM---Yes, businesses do prevent patrons from bringing guns onto the property of their business, but that has no application to a residential rental. When you lease a property to someone that tenant now has a property right there, esp. if it is a residential unit. If a restaurant customer orders and does not have money to pay, the owner can grab the plate back and toss the guy from his restaurant himself. As property owners, we cannot do the same to our tenants that don't pay. --73.141.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by LivetheDream [AZ]) Posted on: Jun 16, 2016 7:39 PM Message:
I believe this issue, like many gun issues is headed to the Supreme Court. The court has held the right to have a weapon at home in Heller vs DC.
Many state laws reinforce this, that you may have a gun in your dwelling or residence, permenant or temporary.
Private property rights of the owner stop where they infringe on the Constutional rights of the lessee or legal occupant. This is different than no pets or no smokers, those are not Constutional or human rights.
There have been IMHO bad and conflicting lower court rulings and I see a showdown coming to define this once and for all. And let's hope they don't answer wrong.
Someone mentioned CCW. There is no difference IMHO in discriminating against someone carrying concealed into a businesd, or someone who is black, or gay. What we need is a black, gay, muslim, gun owner in a same sex, interracial marriage, with adopted kids to bring a lawsuit! :-)
It boils down to the Golden Rule. Do you want to be unarmed and at the mercy of criminals? I'm a multi millionire and I can't afford to hire 24 hr private security. If I get rich or run for President I'll hire someone to carry for me. Until then I, like most of you, am on my own.
If people want a gun let them have it. If there are bad people with guns, kill them. If everyone would just stop imposing their beliefs and phobias on each other, and stop taking each others stuff and hurting each other, we might not need guns.
But until we reach nirvana, if you can have a gun, don't tell me or anyone else we can't have one.
This applies to landlords and Congress. --24.121.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by LivetheDream [AZ]) Posted on: Jun 16, 2016 7:44 PM Message:
BTW - Yes. I'd love to see a movement to require tenants to have a CCW permit.
That instantly solves your background check. No felons, no crazy people, no druggies, no domestic violence history - I have never had a permit holder punch a hole in my walls.
--24.121.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Mickie [OH]) Posted on: Jun 17, 2016 4:31 AM Message:
I wouldn't have a problem with a tenant having a gun. It's their business and not mine. People have a right to protect themselves. The police can't get there in time to protect you in most instances. Having a gun allows you take responsibility for your own protection. On some level when you decided to become a landlord you were taking responsibility for your own financial future. Bottom line - you have to take responsibility for yourself. I wouldn't have it any other way. --70.194.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Posted on: Jun 17, 2016 5:05 AM Message:
gevans, Orlando bar had not one, not two, but three armed police officers confronting the gunman yet he still made it inside. these weren't bar patrons but officers on duty ready to go. what makes you think civilians , with some alcohol in their system would do any better? --104.1.xxx.xx |
Gun ownership (by David [MI]) Posted on: Jun 17, 2016 5:06 AM Message:
don, do you rent your houses Carter Blanche to your tenants, letting them do whatever they wish? --104.1.xxx.xx |
Gun ownership (by Gary [OK]) Posted on: Jun 17, 2016 5:22 AM Message:
I believe that if Mateen had went into a club in the hood he would have shot very few people before he was shot. --166.182.xx.xx |
Gun ownership (by Steve [WA]) Posted on: Jun 17, 2016 11:16 AM Message:
A responsible gun owner would not be drinking --75.134.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Steve [WA]) Posted on: Jun 17, 2016 11:16 AM Message:
Owner should read "carrier" --75.134.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Jun 17, 2016 12:31 PM Message:
Steve, you are correct. --70.209.xxx.xx |
Gun ownership (by John... [MI]) Posted on: Jun 17, 2016 5:45 PM Message:
Actually, in this case -- where the PLAN was to go to a bar for the evening -- I think the much more likely situation would be: A responsible gun owner would have left their gun at home so they could drink.
In other words, even if people COULD have guns in bars all they wanted -- the reality is that people go to bars to drink. Therefore, responsible gun owners should have left them at home.
Sure, they may have been a FEW that were designated drivers (and actually stuck to that -- often, they don't) and therefore been armed. But that means we're talking about a handful, not a hundred. Again, most people go to a bar like this to drink. Especially the ones that stay until 2AM. Therefore, most of those "responsible gun owners" wouldn't have had guns in this situation -- even if it was legally allowed!
So, like David said, if 3 armed and trained police officers couldn't stop this guy from getting inside -- what makes you think a handful of designated drivers inside would have been able to?
- John...
--216.176.x.xxx |
Gun ownership (by gevans [SC]) Posted on: Jun 19, 2016 4:48 AM Message:
Can one of you guys point me to an article that states the gun related facts on this shooting?
The only one I have found says there was ONE armed guard, and he did not directly confront the shooter, but chose to retreat to the bathroom and leave the way clear to evacuate people.
Not saying he did anything wrong, just wondering where you guys are seeing three armed guards. --69.80.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by John... [MI]) Posted on: Jun 20, 2016 6:33 AM Message:
gevans -- this one seems decent. I just found it with a quick search though -- there might be better ones:
www.orlandosentinel.com/news/pulse-orlando-nightclub-shooting/os-orlando-pulse-nightclub-shooting-timeline-htmlstory.html
It is a timeline created based on most of the data available. The important parts related to this would be the very first entry:
"An off-duty Orlando Police Department officer in the nightclub's parking lot hears shots fired and sees Omar Mateen near the entrance. They exchange fire, but the officer realizes he is "outgunned" and retreats to call for backup. Mateen goes inside."
So, that was the first armed person to encounter Mateen at the very start. (From what I understand, he is a cop that works a 2nd job doing security at this bar.) He DID confront the shooter before the shooter went inside.
Then, after he has been inside for a bit (exact time is unknown, but it looks like it was within the first few minutes): "Two backup Orlando police officers arrive. They rush into the club and exchange fire with Mateen, who runs toward the bathrooms."
So, again, three armed and trained cops exchanged fire with him at the very start.
- John...
--207.241.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by gevans [SC]) Posted on: Jun 20, 2016 8:22 AM Message:
Thanks John.
It's an easy thing to armchair quarterback. Not so easy when you are there and in the line of fire. --69.80.xx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Don [PA]) Posted on: Jun 20, 2016 9:36 AM Message:
DavidM, to answer your que., the armed security guards were quickly taken out because the shooter was able to easily identify them as a threat and focus on them as first priority. When a shooter enters a crowd with a hundred people, and some have concealed weapons, who can he focus on? No one, because he has no clue who is going to pull out a gun and shoot him. --69.142.xxx.xxx |
Gun ownership (by Mickie [OH]) Posted on: Jun 20, 2016 11:27 AM Message:
Exactly Don and most will go find easier Vic's where gun control laws disarm regular citizens. --70.194.xxx.xxx |
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