Terrible PM
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Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Nov 24, 2009 12:55 PM
       Terrible PM (by Wallace CPM [VA]) Nov 24, 2009 1:29 PM
       Terrible PM (by Carolyn [MO]) Nov 24, 2009 1:38 PM
       Terrible PM (by Carolyn [MO]) Nov 24, 2009 1:42 PM
       Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Nov 24, 2009 1:43 PM
       Terrible PM (by Martin [MO]) Nov 24, 2009 1:45 PM
       Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Nov 24, 2009 1:51 PM
       Terrible PM (by Gloria Obrien [TN]) Nov 24, 2009 4:03 PM
       Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Nov 24, 2009 4:27 PM
       Terrible PM (by Doug [NJ]) Nov 24, 2009 4:40 PM
       Terrible PM (by OPM [OR]) Nov 24, 2009 5:57 PM
       Terrible PM (by Robert,Ontario,Canada [ON]) Nov 24, 2009 6:00 PM
       Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Nov 24, 2009 7:31 PM
       Terrible PM (by Virden [OH]) Nov 24, 2009 9:02 PM
       Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Nov 24, 2009 9:56 PM
       Terrible PM (by zee [FL]) Nov 24, 2009 10:13 PM
       Terrible PM (by Reid [KS]) Nov 25, 2009 1:35 AM
       Terrible PM (by billy [MA]) Nov 25, 2009 7:20 AM
       Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Nov 25, 2009 8:23 AM
       Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Nov 25, 2009 2:03 PM
       Terrible PM (by Wallace CPM [VA]) Nov 25, 2009 5:13 PM
       Terrible PM (by Dan [MA]) Nov 27, 2009 7:29 AM


Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 12:55 PM
Message:

State Specific Question About: ARIZONA (AZ)

Hi all,

Background: I am a young homeonwner relatively new to the landlord business. I hired a PM when I purchased my property back in Dec '08. She had made many promises and fulfilled none and was soon released by her agency. I was given a new PM with whom I have had very poor relations. He is always very nice and willing over the phone, but never follows through on anything. I have had a dozen HOA violations on the property b/c of an unruly front yard (yes, even in Phoenix!) and my attempts for a gardener went unheeded. I inevitably drove out from CA twice to do the yardwork myself.

Problem: With tons of fines from HOA, I am worried about collecting them later, as my PM has already reduced her rent (against my consent) b/c she can not cover it due to a divorce. I have a local friend who has offered to take over for my PM, but I need to fire my current PM first. However, nearly all of my emails to him go unheeded, and I do not know the situation with the tenant. How would I go about making my PM switch? Can I contact the tenant via the number provided on the rental agreement? Am I eligible to get me PM fees for Nov back due to the unauthorized rent reduction? He honestly doesn't deserve any of them as I have done all the legwork from CA while he collects rent, sits on it for 21 business days, then MAILS it.

Tips for a smooth transition?

Thanks for your reading!

-Michael --71.107.x.xx




Terrible PM (by Wallace CPM [VA]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 1:29 PM
Message:

Contact the broker of the company and send them a cancellation letter per your written agreement. Make sure your "friend" knows how to evict your tenant....she will be a deadbeat soon --205.188.xxx.xx




Terrible PM (by Carolyn [MO]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 1:38 PM
Message:

It sounds as though you have had a bad experience with property managers. However, don't assume that your friend will necessarily have the appropriate skills. I suggest that both of you start reading books such as Landlording by Leigh Robinson.

Leigh (a different Leigh, including gender) in California has property in Arizona. She has figured out ways to deal with property in another state and might have tips on how to make it work. So does Katherine, who lives in Texas and owns a multi-unit in Missouri. --205.188.xxx.xx




Terrible PM (by Carolyn [MO]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 1:42 PM
Message:

Let me add on an experience I had managing a property for a friend. It didn't work.

I had lots of experience with my own property, but she had what I considered to be unrealistic expectations and blamed me if they weren't met. She didn't want to spend money on repairs I felt were necessary, but she didn't. She thought rent should be much higher than was appropriate for the neighborhood. She was expecting to get enough rent versus her mortgage payment each month to help with her own not-quite-making it financial situation.

Finally I suggested she sell. She did, and made some money - but was irritated with me that she didn't make more.

If you want to remain friends with someone acting as your PM, make sure you keep it absolutely businesslike. --205.188.xxx.xx




Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 1:43 PM
Message:

Thanks Wallace! The lease is up in Feb, and I have no doubt that she will bail asap w/o breaking contract. I'm fine with that. Hopefully it won't lead to an eviction, (I doubt so) but I will prep for it, and am ready to begin posting a vacancy. --71.107.x.xx




Terrible PM (by Martin [MO]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 1:45 PM
Message:

Review your PM agreement--it should specify the exact procedure for terminating. --68.92.xxx.xxx




Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 1:51 PM
Message:

Carolyn,

Thanks for the advice. I know what I need from a PM, and that is to collect rent. I travel enough and have enough know-how to be able to do any repairs on my own - and have done so over the past 11 months. As is on a new house, nothing major to report yet...only an A/C capacitor. I am taking less rent than I would like, but am still in the black. My mortgage is VERY low, and I keep the rent low as to find a 'good' tenant. My friend is a very strong personality, and all I need from her is to make sure I get my full every month. The rest his on me, as it has been the past 11 mos. --71.107.x.xx




Terrible PM (by Gloria Obrien [TN]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 4:03 PM
Message:

Here starts the flaming. You must have way too much money to treat your rental like a hobby, it is a business.

You'be been unhappy with your PM since '08 but you don't do anything really.

Quit calling your PM and call the company and send written cancellation by registered mail. It shouldn't take long to figure that out.

You do NOT reduce rent for someone elses troubles unless they have been good tenants for a long time.

Personally I think this is a joke post, you have been way too lax for too long. --208.252.xxx.xx




Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 4:27 PM
Message:

Gloria, I'm sorry, but you're way off base. The 'company' is a small office with maybe 10 employees. As a matter of fact, I am a college student so i do not have 'way too much money.' and i don't know where you come off saying that i don't do anything? also, if you read, i DIDN'T reduce my rent, it was done without my permission and i'm not going to allow it. please read your facts before flaming. --71.107.x.xx




Terrible PM (by Doug [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 4:40 PM
Message:

Finding a PM who cares about a single family home is going to be hard to do... They usually only give attention to the multi unit properties that provide them decent commissions...

You definitely should not have a waited a year to do this... If it is an office run by a broker (not sure how PM works in AZ), call the broker directly and tell him/her that you want to cancel your management agreement, followed by a letter via certified mail saying the same. It is generally effective next calendar month. Although many people are against out of state landlording, I've found it to be quite lucrative - you just need to be very certain you have the proper tradespeople that you can trust to handle emergencies when they come up... --67.81.xxx.xxx




Terrible PM (by OPM [OR]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 5:57 PM
Message:

Hi Mike...

And first thank you for your post..

and wading thru the maze of opinions..

So lets start with... PM.

if it ant't working stop... cancel.. but you know this already...

Look at the PM agreement.. for terminate..

2nd..

Yes contact the tenant.. directly... find out what is going on..

IN THIER OPINION.. granted it is one sided.. but you get to confirm they are there.. and the house is not on fire or some thing like that..

3rd.. being smart.. check AZ statutes to see if you need to have a PM manage for you..

Oregon as an example has a very broad difinition of what activites need a PM...

Ya don't want to have a complecation and the Judge asks who is your PM and you say.. your friend.. with no License..

Dismissed.. next case..

Keep us up dated please.. .really most folks want to help you

Good luck --207.200.xxx.xx




Terrible PM (by Robert,Ontario,Canada [ON]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 6:00 PM
Message:

It is a lot headaches if one owns property withing a short driving distance. One manages the rental property themselves. With price decline of houses and rentals in the Us it would be lot less difficult to buy a rental property with a hours drive. Here the price of houses and rentals have not declined. Owning rental properties is not a hands off business. Here only the larger off shore owners have property management as they in another country. At times even if the property does not make a lot but currency fluctuations make real gains on investment. Over the last year the Loonie has gone up against other currencies which means those who invested have made gains. The apartment buildings for example are a little more then hours drive from the house and ten kilometers from building to building. --216.110.xxx.xx




Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 7:31 PM
Message:

Thanks to Doug and OPM! I was actually told that I legally had to have a PM by my first manager...I was leaving the next day so I naively signed a 13 mo contract..later I did my research and found that there is no such law against being your own.

also, good call! I will contact her and figure out what is REALLY going on. it's so hard to know for sure. my PM maintains that they are behind on everything but I have a hunch that he is the lazy one throwing blame on the tenants. --216.220.xxx.xxx




Terrible PM (by Virden [OH]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 9:02 PM
Message:

I would attend housing court often, and HOA meetings also, if this is too far to become familiar then this is time to consider leaving empty, move there yourself or sell. To keep a grip on the details you have to be close or establish someone who is right there to keep the tenant from getting fined all the time, I want to say it could be the tenant but this is distance landlording and it comes in different colors so you have been warned. --76.241.xxx.xxx




Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 9:56 PM
Message:

Virden,

Your post makes it sound like things are out of control. while it's not going as smoothly as i would like, i hardly think it's worth jumping ship and 'cutting my losses.' so far i just see it as growing pains, and i feel like finding a manager that actually gave a deuce about his job would make a world of difference. --71.107.x.xx




Terrible PM (by zee [FL]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2009 10:13 PM
Message:

Mike, hang in there, you'll do fine. You're learning in the school of HARD KNOX where many of us learned. I doubt that you will ever make this mistake again in choosing a PM without looking over the contract and researching the pm company before you sign. Considering that you were in a hurry, its no wonder that you made this mistake. What matters now is that you try to resolve this issue before it cuts deeper into your pocket.

1st step is to cancel the contract no matter what, even if you signed for two years or a year with an automatic renewal. They will let you cancel, I'm sure, if you threaten them or explain to them how poorly the company managed your property.

I dont think the 2nd step is to worry about getting your fees back and the 2nd step is to insure that everything is back on track with your current tenant to make sure that she pays the HOA fines and or evict her if she does not before she makes it worse for you. You have plenty of time to worry about collecting your fees. It is imperative that you check on this tenant to make sure that she takes care of the hoa fines to avoid the hoa putting a lien on your property. Good luck --71.203.xxx.xxx




Terrible PM (by Reid [KS]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2009 1:35 AM
Message:

lawn care in the desert , arranging the Rocks and pruning the cactus? Get a local high school kid to keep your lawn . Have him email you pictures each month so you can keep track of whats going on. Or get some tenants who have a Clue. Sounds like you may have clueless , helpless morons for tenants?? If you have all these Fines sound like you need people living there that have adult supervision. --70.248.xx.xx




Terrible PM (by billy [MA]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2009 7:20 AM
Message:

if its a sfh i would do it myself.maybe get a realtor if i have a vacancy.i dont think u need a pm for 1 unit. --208.58.x.xx




Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2009 8:23 AM
Message:

thanks for the kind words.

luckily, the HOA makes no deadlines for fines as long as the assesments are paid up. I have a neighbor with a daughter my age, and I think she would be happy to help look over my yard, she seems very nice and we borrowed some tools from her last trip out.

also, I made the huge mistake of not giving myself enough time. the property closed abruptly just before christmas, and I pushed to make it home in time. the PM figured this and talked me into signing, because she knew I wouldn't have time to interview anyone else. a year later and a lesson learned, I'm ready to cut the extra baggage.

I have already scheduled myself a week in Feb to go out and interview prospective renters, and am prepped to do so sooner should my current bail, although I think she will hang on. --216.220.xxx.xxx




Terrible PM (by Mike C [AZ]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2009 2:03 PM
Message:

alright, I got a hold of my PM, but only because I went over his head and BCC'd his superior. He said that the tenants usually paid by now (the checks are cut 21st business day) and he didn't know why the rent was short. then he asked me if he should try and get it from them or not! ummm, duh? I feel like there is something he isn't telling me. now the tenant owes me $375...and there's only an $800 deposit. what now? anyone have a sample pm contract cancellation letter? --216.220.xxx.xxx




Terrible PM (by Wallace CPM [VA]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2009 5:13 PM
Message:

Ignore Doug/NJ * he probably voted for Corzine....there are good property managers - they have good websites, marketing programs, repair and maintenance programs and they respond to clients!! --64.12.xxx.xx




Terrible PM (by Dan [MA]) Posted on: Nov 27, 2009 7:29 AM
Message:

Good PM's are out there, but you have to do all your due diligence. You must interview them and research them and check on the properties/tenants they currently manage and ask lots of questions. You are making them your legal representative. A good one can make you lots of money and save you lots of time. A real bad one can bring you to the brink of bankruptcy. Also, it is best to manage some property yourself for a while before ever going out and hiring a PM. Without that personal experience, it is tough to know if the PM is doing a good job or not. --76.19.xx.xx





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