unauthorized tenant 2 UD
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unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by brewcityb [WI]) Jul 1, 2008 8:10 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by ManateeAlley [FL]) Jul 1, 2008 8:38 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by LC [IL]) Jul 1, 2008 9:00 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Mike45 [NV]) Jul 1, 2008 9:17 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Nancy [IN]) Jul 1, 2008 9:19 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by brewcityb [WI]) Jul 1, 2008 9:42 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Josh [CA]) Jul 1, 2008 9:54 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Josh [CA]) Jul 1, 2008 9:57 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Mike in San Diego [CA]) Jul 1, 2008 10:13 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by brewcityb [WI]) Jul 1, 2008 11:07 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by RJ [WI]) Jul 1, 2008 11:32 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Josh [CA]) Jul 2, 2008 12:47 AM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by spf [NC]) Jul 2, 2008 7:23 AM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by brewcityb [WI]) Jul 2, 2008 8:17 AM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Josh [CA]) Jul 2, 2008 9:49 AM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by RJ [WI]) Jul 2, 2008 12:57 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Lynda [TX]) Jul 2, 2008 1:38 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by ManateeAlley [FL]) Jul 2, 2008 6:21 PM
       unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by CTGF [CT]) Jul 3, 2008 2:55 PM

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by brewcityb [WI]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 8:10 PM

State Specific Question About: WISCONSIN (WI)

UPDATE: so I met with him today just now. did not go well. before I was to meet him I saw his GF hop in her car and leave. met with him and wanted to see what his intentions were. collected the rent in cash but no additional deposit (gave me a rubber check that I did not accept, like I mentioned to him before that I will accept cash only.) I took the rent money and told him the check is not going to work. I then handed him a 28day notice terminating tenancy and he went ballistic, he said this is not a lease! chased me down and asked me for the money back.

I told him it is for July rent he handed me a letter that he prepared prior which stated he wanted to use his security deposit for the last months rent!! (I'm glad I collected the rent first, lease states this is not allowed) and accused me of entering the premises without notice! so he chased me upstairs and demanded his money, that he just gave me and also when he would get his security deposit back,

I told him that as per the lease he would get it within 21 days after surrendering the property and told me that it was BS. why did I take the money then if I was going to give him the notice!

I told him that it was for July rent again and he didn't like that, started yelling more, at this point I am standing at my back door and my daughter (15months) was directly behind me.

So I put her in and told him there was nothing to discuss and that I am going inside now and he kept talking and yelled so you are going to close the door on my face now huh!? like he would try to kick the door down, or break the glass or something so i opened back up and told him sternly what do you want?! there is nothing more to discuss and was worried he would do something rash that he would later regret.

he raised his voice again and went ranting and raving about how unethical and unjust this is and that why did I take the money then? I told him again its for July rent and that the 28day notice was a courtesy and that he has a month to leave yet. he went on and on and brought up the fact that he is allowed guests and that they haven't been here for two weeks and accused me of being an amateur stalker for snapping photos of the cars in the street. I told him that there is nothing to talk about and that the issue was beyond that and that it is my right to end the tenancy with proper notice for no reason which I did, and that if he wanted to pursue this furthur we can let the judge decide.

his words were "the commissioner is my relative, so I am not worried about that" WHAT!?

he then puffed up and got up in my face, like 2 inches away and I did not stand down and was ready, but I remembered shortly before reading the post about the landlord who scuffled with the tenants BF and thought that I did not want to jeopardize my situation and that he is upset ( he was drinking a bit when I went down to speak with him) so I stepped back and told him that I would call the police, I let him rant and rave and I asked him to please leave. I reminded him about his history at the location and problems with payments and that he has lied to me several times

he said what i did was wrong and un-humanitarian and that I can be sure that there will be damage to the property, i told him that he should reconsider as I will go after him for damages and that he wouldn't want an eviction or suit on his record and that he would not get his whole deposit back if that were the case if anything back. I tried to leave so many times but he was extremely loud and aggressive and to be honest started to get under my skin like he was maybe baiting me.

i asked him again to carefully consider his actions and good bye. he said fine and that karma would pay me back and that he hopes that my daughter grows up to be a good person with me as a father!! I told him that he needs to leave NOW.

since he paid me for July should I allow him to stay till the end of the month as the notice i gave him allows only to the 29th? I want to make sure that if I do end up in court that I not lose due to a technicality

what a mess and what an encounter. hopefully it is over but is yet to be seen. --76.202.xxx.xxx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by ManateeAlley [FL]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 8:38 PM

You need to have proof of notification. Mail him the notice of termination REGULAR MAIL, with delivery confirmation... --71.196.xx.xxx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by LC [IL]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 9:00 PM

GOOD FOR YOU for standing your ground!

I have never had this happen with a renter, but with the wh ite tr ash neighbor's next to the MH I own.

Why is it they think the louder they are the "righter" they are?

I felt my adreneline go up just reading your account.

You'll have a challenging month ahead, but just keep going, acting professional and not rising to any baiting.


unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Mike45 [NV]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 9:17 PM

I am concerned about your collecting the rent for the month of July but giving a notice terminating the lease as of July 29. I am not familiar with WI law, or with 28 day notices. I would probably serve a new "28 notice" terminating his lease and possession as of July 31.

I don't know WI law, but having the rent period and the notice period coincide seems cleaner.


unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Nancy [IN]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 9:19 PM

For your own safety, do NOT meet tenants in person (if it can be avoided) to discuss unpleasant things, or, for goodness sakes, give notices to terminate!

Use letters. You need a paper trail anyway, should this end up in court. --65.54.xxx.xx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by brewcityb [WI]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 9:42 PM

thanks for the support and words of wisdom everyone and I plan on mailing him the notice tomorrow morning as recommended by manateealley and Mike45 and issue it for July 31st to be on the safe side as i was wondering about that

*side note the first part of this issue was posted under the heading unauthorised tenants HELP (i know I spelled unauthorized wrong by accident) for those who are wondering what I am talking about --76.202.xxx.xxx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Josh [CA]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 9:54 PM

He lives upstairs Nancy. Hard sitch to deal with.

Awwww come here and get a Mr.LL

{{{{{-group hug-}}}}} It's gonna be ok. I'm giving you a Atta Boy pat on the back. Has your adrinaline stopped pulsing at your temples yet?

He will never get it. He is the one stepping outside of the law, the rules of the rental document.

Yeah so his who-ever is the commish of whatever.

And so? You are within the confines of the law. He isn't. A stalker? ROTF... You LIVE THERE


In a way taking his check might of been a good thing. If it was good he may have stopped payment on it. Giving a bad check is a crime.

Just let that go for now.

You are right of course about the money he owes for July.and about the SD. You did good!

If he moves out tomorrow has the place broom clean and gives you the keys I would give him his july rent back. See if the pita takes this bait if he confronts you again. Heck I might even type up the security deposit then and there just so I would be done with him.


unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Josh [CA]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 9:57 PM

Good deal. I was wondering about the 28 day notice thing. Never heard of that before. Is that a WI state thing or something?


unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Mike in San Diego [CA]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 10:13 PM

I know it seems like going back and opening the door again, and again, and again makes the situation better, but it actually makes it worse. When you're done, close the door, lock it, and go away somewhere where you can't hear the shouting. If he busts it down (extremely unlikely), you won't have to worry about 30 day notice anymore, the breaking and entering charge will get him out tonight. If he doesn't (more likely), the argument is over.

You increase the chances of things going poorly if you return and keep baiting him. You already gave him the bad news. Let him go back to his place and hate you. --68.8.xxx.xxx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by brewcityb [WI]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 11:07 PM

thanks again guys


thanks, yeah the adrenalin was pumping hard for a while afterwards and what a challenge it was to maintain in that situation! I must say I have learned a lot from this, scratch that learning a lot from this

I guess it is a wi thing as it a standard doc drafted by a lawyer and provided by Wisconsin legal blank.

28day notice terminating tenancy

"this notice terminates your tenancy and requires you, and anyone living with you, to vacate the premises listed above on or before________, which is the last day of the rental period.

if you have not vacated the premises by the date listed above the owner may start eviction action against you pursuant to chapter 799 of the Wisconsin statutes.

description of premises________

DOUBLE RENT: pursuant to 704.27 Wis. Stats an owner can recover as damages against a tenant, a minimum of twice the daily rent amount, if the tenant remains in possession of the premises after the expiration of the notice."

when to use

1)MTM tenancy (no reason required)

2)Tenancy at will (no reason required)


unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by RJ [WI]) Posted on: Jul 1, 2008 11:32 PM

In your follow up letter to him, make sure to mention how he stated that he will damage the place willfully and mention that if he follows through with that threat, you fully intend to recover any and all damages even if it exceeds the security deposit.

You may also mention to him that if he stays past you plan on going after double the daily rent. Hopefully, that will kick him in the rear to actually get out. --66.84.xxx.xxx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Josh [CA]) Posted on: Jul 2, 2008 12:47 AM

I wish we had that double hold over fee in CA.

No such luck.

. --71.108.x.xxx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by spf [NC]) Posted on: Jul 2, 2008 7:23 AM

Good for you for remaining calm. I agree opening the door again and again just prolonged it and let him build a bigger head of steam. He was baiting you and wanted a fight, and you were encouraging this by continuing to engage and listen to his nonsense.

Stop trying to be so nice - you are under no obligation to stand there and take abuse from a tenant. And with your child watching? You let it go on too long. Always stay in control and keep it brief.

If this ever happens again with a future tenant, send the notice by mail and if/when the tenant confronts you, do as you did by stating facts once, twice if absolutely necessary, then close the door and leave it closed.

Since this current guy is such a hothead who doesn't seem to understand the difference between July rent and security deposits, and he likes to make threats and lie, make sure you always have your cell phone with you when answering your door or outside. If he confronts you again in a hostile manner, or makes any kind of threat to do you or your property harm, call the police and let them know that a tenant who you've served with a non-renewal notice is threatening your safety and/or property and you need assistance. If you're child is present when he's mouthing off, call immediately and tell them you need assistance because he's acting agressive and threatening in front of you AND your minor child. Maybe a visit from the cops will calm the guy down and help him go away quietly and without damaging your place.

For now, while it is still fresh, document everything you remember him saying. The date, time, threats made. You never know if you may need to bring it up in court.

Send him a copy of the termination notice so you have a paper trail. Also send a move-out letter that spells out what he needs to do to get his security returned. If you check the archives of MrLL there are some great examples of move-out letters others use.

Keep us posted on how it goes.


unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by brewcityb [WI]) Posted on: Jul 2, 2008 8:17 AM

interesting thing happened, i got a voice mail from him apologizing for his behavior and please extend the apology to my family, that I am a just guy and have been fair with him all along and thanked me for giving him an opportunity here and that I am appreciated as a landlord and assured me that he would take extra care to ensure that the unit is in tip top move in shape upon his departure

we'll see what happens..... --76.202.xxx.xxx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Josh [CA]) Posted on: Jul 2, 2008 9:49 AM

Wow well whatta-yah-know there is sanity after the storm. Good job brewcityb.

That took guts and a level head. High five.



unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by RJ [WI]) Posted on: Jul 2, 2008 12:57 PM

Translation: I was drunk as a skunk and for the past month my GF has been looking for other appartments, today she droped the bomb on me that EVERY place requires a good recomendation from current landlord and no eviction type filings (remember, we have ccap in WI). I promise not to distroy the place as bad if you give me a good reference to the next landlord that will be calling in the next couple days. If I dont get a good reference, I will likely start drinking again... --66.84.xxx.xx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by Lynda [TX]) Posted on: Jul 2, 2008 1:38 PM

Brew-right now go and write/type up a "memo for record" of the incedent. State the date, time and location of the altercation, and give a sentence or 2 of the background, so someone weeks later (like a judge?) can read the memo and know the whole story. Then tell about the specific incedent. What you did, why you did it, what he did, how he escalated it, he threatenered you in front of your daughter, would not leave your doorway, etc.

If there was any altercation previous to this, write one up about that happening too. If so, in this current memo reference the earlier incedent. There may be another altercation in the works as he gets angrier and more frustrated at the end of July. You have to have documentation/records of his behavior, even if you have to write them yourself. In court (if it goes that far)HE will have no documentation--you will.

From this point on, ALL communication shd be in writing. When you send out the notice with the changed dates (as mentioned above) I would include a short letter stating the lease violations--that his lease clearly states (in paragraph X) that use of SD for last month's rent is not allowed--of his failure to abide by (paragraph Y) the requirement for written 30 day notice to vacate--and also mention that you have recirded his threat to damage the property, and all damage will come out of his SD. Any damages that excede the SD will have legal action taken against him and will go on his credit report. "Please abide by your contract, leaving the property clean and undamaged, and I will return to you any portion of SD that I did not have to use to clean and repair after your tenancy." --140.140.xx.x

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by ManateeAlley [FL]) Posted on: Jul 2, 2008 6:21 PM

Save the voice mail for court.... --71.196.xx.xxx

unauthorized tenant 2 UD (by CTGF [CT]) Posted on: Jul 3, 2008 2:55 PM

Do you have my ex tenant?

Glad you stood your ground and remember, document, document, document...what I did was not only take a ton of pictures (take more than one of any situation as you all know, even with digital, the picture may not come out clear enough) and for each event, I documented the details on my desk calendar so when I go back to fill in the log I have date and time included. Good luck, signed CTGF --70.235.xx.xxx

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